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AMP is not the savior you describe it to be, and web developers are not against lean websites. The real bloat comes from ads and excessive tracking, and you can

AMP is not the savior you describe it to be, and web developers are not against lean websites. The real bloat comes from ads and excessive tracking, and you can test that by installing uBlock Origin in Firefox for Android and see for yourself how the web suddenly becomes fast and lean. I've downvoted this post because it lacks substance, and the resulting arguments will derail the thread and bury actionable information that was shared below. It's depressing how most of these threads could initiate action but seem to be derailed.

izacus 7y ago
I didn't describe AMP as any kind of saviour and my choice of word "purgatory" was very deliberate. I'm also sorry if you feel debating the reasons why AMP was created and popularised are derailing a slew unconstructive complaining.
- dessant 7y ago
  Again, install Firefox for Android with uBlock Origin, and see your opinion change about the main reason mobile sites are slow. Pages load fast and are responsive even on older phones if you use an ad blocker. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.mozilla.firefox&hl=en_US https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.mozilla.fi... https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/android/addon/ublock-origin/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/android/addon/ublock-origin...
  - iteratorloopmap 7y ago
    I use ubo and have used AMP in past. UBO is an excellent ad blocker, but as far as bandwidth savings are concerned, it doesn't come close to AMP. Of course I use UBO with JS off by default which is better and arguably more secure. But I still occasionally have to unbreak sites.
  - sandy123 7y ago
    Should installing an adblocker be a common knowledge. The world is not made up of techies
  - zentiggr 7y ago
    DuckDuckGo browser with Blockada on Android. Not just web ads, but most app-internal ads, all gone.
  - tssva 7y ago
    Your suggestion to install Firefox for Android for a performent mobile web experience undercuts whatever other arguments you may make. Firefox for Android is a UX and performance disaster which is likely why Mozilla has chosen to start from scratch and develop a replacement browser for Android.
    - dessant 7y ago
      Install Firefox for Android with uBlock Origin to see how ads and tracking destroy mobile performance. The setup I described loads pages faster than Chrome.
mcv 7y ago
Yeah, but Google wants the excessive tracking and ads.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- vorpalhex 7y ago
  Should read: "Google wants their excessive tracking and their ads."
EpicEng 7y ago
>and web developers are not against lean websites Of course no one is _against_ good performance, but web devs obviously don't care enough to do anything about it. There's no practical difference between the two.
- dessant 7y ago
  Most web developers do make fairly lean websites, but that is not enough when ads and a dozen tracking scripts which in part are supplied by Google are slapped over their work.
  - cameronbrown 7y ago
    It's a bad idea to just slap AdSense and analytics in a page. If they're a requirement then they need to be properly integrated and thought about. It can be done properly but nobody really does. FYI Personal opinion not Google's.
  - xvector 7y ago
    Which is completely 100% irrelevant from the end-user perspective. Just to be clear, I hate AMP, but I also feel a sort of pleasurable vindication in the pain that developers and companies must now go through because of the horrendously slow trackers and ads they used to fill their pages with.
    - dessant 7y ago
      Google could restrict the content loaded in AdSense iframes and apply AMP restrictions to ad content only. They also have the means to limit the number of ads partners can load on a page, and restrict the overzealous use of Google Tag Manager which slows down sites. Google offers both the poison and the antidote, and each of their solutions, see what they're doing with request blocking in Chrome, happens to erode user liberties and privacy rights to concentrate power around Google properties.
- e_proxus 7y ago
  Page rank would make them care. Can't understand why Google didn't just down rank heavy pages...

izacus 7y ago

I didn't describe AMP as any kind of saviour and my choice of word "purgatory" was very deliberate. I'm also sorry if you feel debating the reasons why AMP was created and popularised are derailing a slew unconstructive complaining.

dessant 7y ago
Again, install Firefox for Android with uBlock Origin, and see your opinion change about the main reason mobile sites are slow. Pages load fast and are responsive even on older phones if you use an ad blocker. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.mozilla.firefox&hl=en_US https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.mozilla.fi... https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/android/addon/ublock-origin/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/android/addon/ublock-origin...
- iteratorloopmap 7y ago
  I use ubo and have used AMP in past. UBO is an excellent ad blocker, but as far as bandwidth savings are concerned, it doesn't come close to AMP. Of course I use UBO with JS off by default which is better and arguably more secure. But I still occasionally have to unbreak sites.
- sandy123 7y ago
  Should installing an adblocker be a common knowledge. The world is not made up of techies
- zentiggr 7y ago
  DuckDuckGo browser with Blockada on Android. Not just web ads, but most app-internal ads, all gone.
- tssva 7y ago
  Your suggestion to install Firefox for Android for a performent mobile web experience undercuts whatever other arguments you may make. Firefox for Android is a UX and performance disaster which is likely why Mozilla has chosen to start from scratch and develop a replacement browser for Android.
  - dessant 7y ago
    Install Firefox for Android with uBlock Origin to see how ads and tracking destroy mobile performance. The setup I described loads pages faster than Chrome.

mcv 7y ago

Yeah, but Google wants the excessive tracking and ads.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
vorpalhex 7y ago
Should read: "Google wants their excessive tracking and their ads."

EpicEng 7y ago

>and web developers are not against lean websites Of course no one is _against_ good performance, but web devs obviously don't care enough to do anything about it. There's no practical difference between the two.

dessant 7y ago
Most web developers do make fairly lean websites, but that is not enough when ads and a dozen tracking scripts which in part are supplied by Google are slapped over their work.
- cameronbrown 7y ago
  It's a bad idea to just slap AdSense and analytics in a page. If they're a requirement then they need to be properly integrated and thought about. It can be done properly but nobody really does. FYI Personal opinion not Google's.
- xvector 7y ago
  Which is completely 100% irrelevant from the end-user perspective. Just to be clear, I hate AMP, but I also feel a sort of pleasurable vindication in the pain that developers and companies must now go through because of the horrendously slow trackers and ads they used to fill their pages with.
  - dessant 7y ago
    Google could restrict the content loaded in AdSense iframes and apply AMP restrictions to ad content only. They also have the means to limit the number of ads partners can load on a page, and restrict the overzealous use of Google Tag Manager which slows down sites. Google offers both the poison and the antidote, and each of their solutions, see what they're doing with request blocking in Chrome, happens to erode user liberties and privacy rights to concentrate power around Google properties.
e_proxus 7y ago
Page rank would make them care. Can't understand why Google didn't just down rank heavy pages...