3 ms·

You're missing the mark here by quite a bit. First of all, LineageOS has nothing to do with iOS and you aren't about to get the masses moving over to LineageOS

by bdamm 7y ago

You're missing the mark here by quite a bit. First of all, LineageOS has nothing to do with iOS and you aren't about to get the masses moving over to LineageOS any time soon. Feel free to tinker, but know that it is not an answer to Apple's iOS. Second, GPS sucks terribly in many cases. Are you inside a building? Inside a city financial core? Inside a tunnel? Also, did you know that unassisted GPS takes minutes to establish a lock even in most good cases; it is only because of the tower-provided assistance that GPS can resolve in less than a minute, ever. Third, it doesn't matter what the location source is. The issue is what controls are in place for using the location data. And for sure relying on GPS does not solve that problem.

javajosh 7y ago
LineageOS has nothing to do with iOS It's a product in the same category (mobile OS) that has a feature (privacy preserving location measurement) that another product does not. you aren't about to get the masses moving over You are using a strawman there. That was not my purpose in posting. This is Hacker News; I'm sharing my experience, presumably, with other intellectually curious people who might be surprised to know that a rather obscure option exists that they might not know about. GPS sucks terribly in many cases I think this deserves some study. I don't see why, in theory, it would need to be the case; the GPSTest app seems to do an excellent job of tracking satellites and reaquiring. The first time I used it it took ~2 minutes. But every time since it's been immediate. It may be cynical of me, but I think I can be forgiven if don't think either Google or Apple are incentivized to fix GPS acquisition times. Continual, passive scanning of the local EM environment is much more information rich for them, and constitutes a considerable surveillance advantage. Bluetooth scanning especially allows constant, dynamic update of every person you are around. So by using these systems you're not just violating your own privacy, but anyone around you. So, despite the downvotes, I am very proud of my comment and believe it to be quite on topic. Thanks.
dkarl 7y ago
Agreed; it seems obvious to me that location needs improvement in a lot of cases. When I use an app like Lyft I am now careful to avoid using "current location" because even when it looks roughly accurate one second the app might use a different location reading a second later that is across the street and down the block.
iamaelephant 7y ago
> Also, did you know that unassisted GPS takes minutes to establish a lock even in most good cases; it is only because of the tower-provided assistance that GPS can resolve in less than a minute, ever. Then how does every GPS device without a network connection work? I'm no GPS expert by my understanding is that GPS lock can be attained far more quickly if the device caches satellite position data and uses that to assist. That's why a Garmin watch may take 3 minutes to lock on first use (or after departing an international flight) but will subsequently lock in seconds after that.
- chipotle_coyote 7y ago
  I think the assertion about unassisted GPS taking minutes to establish a lock in good cases simply isn't correct; my car's in-dash navigation system will often take minutes to establish a satellite lock if it starts up in a garage, but if it starts up outside, it's often well under half a minute. (Ephemeris data is broadcast from satellites every 30 seconds.) While it's been a long, long time since I worked in the GPS field (I was a contract technical writer at Global Locate for a few months, a company that created one of the first A-GPS networks), it's my understanding that GPS receivers can cache almanac data (the basic orbital positions of GPS satellites) but not ephemeris data (more precise orbital information, including clock information, from individual satellites). To get a GPS lock, your GPS unit needs to get ephemeris data from three satellites. Assisted GPS provides initial ephemeris data over the cellular network so your phone or other cellular device can get it much faster.

by bdamm 7y ago

javajosh 7y ago

LineageOS has nothing to do with iOS It's a product in the same category (mobile OS) that has a feature (privacy preserving location measurement) that another product does not. you aren't about to get the masses moving over You are using a strawman there. That was not my purpose in posting. This is Hacker News; I'm sharing my experience, presumably, with other intellectually curious people who might be surprised to know that a rather obscure option exists that they might not know about. GPS sucks terribly in many cases I think this deserves some study. I don't see why, in theory, it would need to be the case; the GPSTest app seems to do an excellent job of tracking satellites and reaquiring. The first time I used it it took ~2 minutes. But every time since it's been immediate. It may be cynical of me, but I think I can be forgiven if don't think either Google or Apple are incentivized to fix GPS acquisition times. Continual, passive scanning of the local EM environment is much more information rich for them, and constitutes a considerable surveillance advantage. Bluetooth scanning especially allows constant, dynamic update of every person you are around. So by using these systems you're not just violating your own privacy, but anyone around you. So, despite the downvotes, I am very proud of my comment and believe it to be quite on topic. Thanks.

dkarl 7y ago

Agreed; it seems obvious to me that location needs improvement in a lot of cases. When I use an app like Lyft I am now careful to avoid using "current location" because even when it looks roughly accurate one second the app might use a different location reading a second later that is across the street and down the block.

iamaelephant 7y ago

> Also, did you know that unassisted GPS takes minutes to establish a lock even in most good cases; it is only because of the tower-provided assistance that GPS can resolve in less than a minute, ever. Then how does every GPS device without a network connection work? I'm no GPS expert by my understanding is that GPS lock can be attained far more quickly if the device caches satellite position data and uses that to assist. That's why a Garmin watch may take 3 minutes to lock on first use (or after departing an international flight) but will subsequently lock in seconds after that.

chipotle_coyote 7y ago
I think the assertion about unassisted GPS taking minutes to establish a lock in good cases simply isn't correct; my car's in-dash navigation system will often take minutes to establish a satellite lock if it starts up in a garage, but if it starts up outside, it's often well under half a minute. (Ephemeris data is broadcast from satellites every 30 seconds.) While it's been a long, long time since I worked in the GPS field (I was a contract technical writer at Global Locate for a few months, a company that created one of the first A-GPS networks), it's my understanding that GPS receivers can cache almanac data (the basic orbital positions of GPS satellites) but not ephemeris data (more precise orbital information, including clock information, from individual satellites). To get a GPS lock, your GPS unit needs to get ephemeris data from three satellites. Assisted GPS provides initial ephemeris data over the cellular network so your phone or other cellular device can get it much faster.