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Huge car/gear nerd here and I just cant get behind this at all. The problem with this is that while you may get drivers with great skill, preparation, network a

by S_A_P 7y ago

Huge car/gear nerd here and I just cant get behind this at all. The problem with this is that while you may get drivers with great skill, preparation, network and just plain old luck to have a successful run, you can also have 2 knuckle dragging morons who just want to go fast in the name of fun and "adventure". And its not a question of "if" its a question of when something will go wrong as the record requires a faster and faster average speed. If you look at the GPS "proof", their top speed on this run was 193. At that speed, you are traveling roughly the distance of a football field every SECOND. A deer, slow moving vehicle, mechanical failure or miscalculation will cause things to go very wrong. Even cars built for autobahn travel will not survive a major crash at that speed. Other vehicles are not going to expect someone to approach them at that speed and are also likely to make a mistake as they sort this out. This is a bad idea anyway you slice it. If you want to traverse the country quickly, catch a flight...

totalQueer 7y ago
Then you're actually just not that much of a huge car/gear nerd, after all, are you?
close04 7y ago
> Cannonball drivers, including Toman and Tabbutt, claim to be hyper-focused and safe while driving two to three times the posted speed limit It's hard not to become overconfident and over-reliant on technology and subsequently assume your driving skills are close to perfection, without even realizing that even the perfect driver cannot avoid all the other drivers' mistakes. This is an achievement but it's performed under different conditions than any other driver attempting it will encounter. Getting the record because the police just felt more laid back that night for example is like beating up an old Muhammad Ali and saying you must be the best boxer.
- PhasmaFelis 7y ago
  Yup. Plenty of drunks "claim to be hyper-focused and safe" too. You can't trust people's judgment about themselves, especially not when they're doing something obviously dangerous for their own gratification.
dexen 7y ago
>Even cars built for autobahn travel will not survive a major crash at that speed. One can't realistically ask people to only ever do what's safe. As a species we're built to operate at certain risk level. If you track the risks of business, leisure, travel, etc., through ages and cultures, they do show remarkable stability. As soon as better technology, organization, skills, and so on come along, people start going faster, harder, further, more intensely and such. You can make superficially reasonable arguments, but you can't change the fact that risk-taking is necessary for gains. This observation is built into our, humans, very nature, and everybody has a natural grasp of it.
endorphone 7y ago
It seems like a pretty big undertaking to draw in the "knuckledraggers". Knuckledraggers just go blasting down the breakdown lane during rush hour. It's dangerous -- primarily to them -- but I can't help but admire and respect what they've done. As to the top speed -- there are areas in the West where you can see tens of miles with absolutely nothing on either side of the road.
- PhasmaFelis 7y ago
  > It's dangerous -- primarily to them They're endangering everyone on the road with them. No one would care if the drivers were the only ones in danger.
  - endorphone 7y ago
    Why are you repeating what I said, yet as if you're stating a contrary point?
MuffinFlavored 7y ago
> This is a bad idea anyway you slice it. I do not disagree at all. I am just confused on why this is 'romanticized' and 'published'. If I went and robbed my neighbor of $10k in a record breaking "quick" fashion, would I get journalists at my door looking to publish articles around it?
- endorphone 7y ago
  Everyone speeds. Everyone. Everyone breaks traffic laws. Most see traffic enforcement where there are no victims as heavy-handed. Comparing that with a robbery is specious. "But they could have..." But they didn't. Nor have the many who came before. The risk profile of these guys is less than someone who is checking a text while driving. (Okay, a tiny, tiny minority of drivers never break the law. They are the extreme exception)
- tomatotomato37 7y ago
  No, because anyone with a bumpkey and a couple days to kill on staking the place out can do that. If you went and broke into the Natural History Museum to steal the Hope Diamond than you too would have journalists breaking down your door in order to get your story, because the latter actually takes an impressive amount of skill.
nck4222 7y ago
The "well they drive fast in Germany every day" argument doesn't hold water either. 1) Even on the parts of the autobahn with unrestricted speeds, 130km is still the recommended upper limit, and you're more liable in a collision if you go faster than that. 2) Many people in Germany don't agree with unrestricted speeds, and politicians have compared it to gun law debates in the US. 3) Germany has higher than average deaths per 1000 km driven (for an EU country).
- jaclaz 7y ago
  >3) Germany has higher than average deaths per 1000 km driven (for an EU country). Source? On Wikipedia similar data doesn't seem like confirming this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-r... The referenced paper: https://www.itf-oecd.org/sites/default/files/docs/irtad-road-safety-annual-report-2018_2.pdf https://www.itf-oecd.org/sites/default/files/docs/irtad-road... (page 21) places Germany as "better" than Netherlands, France, Austria and Belgium (the latter is on par with the US)
Ididntdothis 7y ago
"Even cars built for autobahn travel will not survive a major crash at that speed. " I don’t care if they destroy their own cars but in reality they will destroy other people's cars. You also can't expect other people who do their daily driving to account for idiots going at such high speed. Just a stupid and reckless thing to do. With all the Twitter shaming going on for minor offenses these guys deserve a major shaming.
downerending 7y ago
> Even cars built for autobahn travel will not survive a major crash at that speed. I couldn't care less if they're killed--they're clearly asking for it. It's the innocent bystanders that will inevitably die that concerns me.
WorldMaker 7y ago
This is why I've been finding the splits/differences with Electric Cannonball Runs fascinating. EVs have the added planning skill needed of requiring charging stops (and the related benefit that some "record breaks" over the years are just the addition of a charging stop in the right place). But also, Electric runners seem to have settled a lot more on sticking to posted speed limits, as a gentleman's rule to the game, in part because more EVs make the speed limits clear in GPS displays and in part because some assisted-driving has also infiltrated the EV records. (A lot of drivers using Tesla's cruise control tech.) But also mostly just because there is so much skill and planning in the recharge stops game that speeding isn't necessary for the fun of the sport / ability to break records, because there's plenty of other things to do. I'm not sure that it will last much longer that Electric Cannonball Runs will focus more on speed limit following, but I hope that it does. It's a better sport that way that it is more "gentlemanly".

by S_A_P 7y ago

totalQueer 7y ago

Then you're actually just not that much of a huge car/gear nerd, after all, are you?

close04 7y ago

> Cannonball drivers, including Toman and Tabbutt, claim to be hyper-focused and safe while driving two to three times the posted speed limit It's hard not to become overconfident and over-reliant on technology and subsequently assume your driving skills are close to perfection, without even realizing that even the perfect driver cannot avoid all the other drivers' mistakes. This is an achievement but it's performed under different conditions than any other driver attempting it will encounter. Getting the record because the police just felt more laid back that night for example is like beating up an old Muhammad Ali and saying you must be the best boxer.

PhasmaFelis 7y ago
Yup. Plenty of drunks "claim to be hyper-focused and safe" too. You can't trust people's judgment about themselves, especially not when they're doing something obviously dangerous for their own gratification.

dexen 7y ago

>Even cars built for autobahn travel will not survive a major crash at that speed. One can't realistically ask people to only ever do what's safe. As a species we're built to operate at certain risk level. If you track the risks of business, leisure, travel, etc., through ages and cultures, they do show remarkable stability. As soon as better technology, organization, skills, and so on come along, people start going faster, harder, further, more intensely and such. You can make superficially reasonable arguments, but you can't change the fact that risk-taking is necessary for gains. This observation is built into our, humans, very nature, and everybody has a natural grasp of it.

endorphone 7y ago

It seems like a pretty big undertaking to draw in the "knuckledraggers". Knuckledraggers just go blasting down the breakdown lane during rush hour. It's dangerous -- primarily to them -- but I can't help but admire and respect what they've done. As to the top speed -- there are areas in the West where you can see tens of miles with absolutely nothing on either side of the road.

PhasmaFelis 7y ago
> It's dangerous -- primarily to them They're endangering everyone on the road with them. No one would care if the drivers were the only ones in danger.
- endorphone 7y ago
  Why are you repeating what I said, yet as if you're stating a contrary point?

MuffinFlavored 7y ago

> This is a bad idea anyway you slice it. I do not disagree at all. I am just confused on why this is 'romanticized' and 'published'. If I went and robbed my neighbor of $10k in a record breaking "quick" fashion, would I get journalists at my door looking to publish articles around it?

endorphone 7y ago
Everyone speeds. Everyone. Everyone breaks traffic laws. Most see traffic enforcement where there are no victims as heavy-handed. Comparing that with a robbery is specious. "But they could have..." But they didn't. Nor have the many who came before. The risk profile of these guys is less than someone who is checking a text while driving. (Okay, a tiny, tiny minority of drivers never break the law. They are the extreme exception)
tomatotomato37 7y ago
No, because anyone with a bumpkey and a couple days to kill on staking the place out can do that. If you went and broke into the Natural History Museum to steal the Hope Diamond than you too would have journalists breaking down your door in order to get your story, because the latter actually takes an impressive amount of skill.

nck4222 7y ago

The "well they drive fast in Germany every day" argument doesn't hold water either. 1) Even on the parts of the autobahn with unrestricted speeds, 130km is still the recommended upper limit, and you're more liable in a collision if you go faster than that. 2) Many people in Germany don't agree with unrestricted speeds, and politicians have compared it to gun law debates in the US. 3) Germany has higher than average deaths per 1000 km driven (for an EU country).

jaclaz 7y ago
>3) Germany has higher than average deaths per 1000 km driven (for an EU country). Source? On Wikipedia similar data doesn't seem like confirming this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-r... The referenced paper: https://www.itf-oecd.org/sites/default/files/docs/irtad-road-safety-annual-report-2018_2.pdf https://www.itf-oecd.org/sites/default/files/docs/irtad-road... (page 21) places Germany as "better" than Netherlands, France, Austria and Belgium (the latter is on par with the US)

Ididntdothis 7y ago

"Even cars built for autobahn travel will not survive a major crash at that speed. " I don’t care if they destroy their own cars but in reality they will destroy other people's cars. You also can't expect other people who do their daily driving to account for idiots going at such high speed. Just a stupid and reckless thing to do. With all the Twitter shaming going on for minor offenses these guys deserve a major shaming.

downerending 7y ago

> Even cars built for autobahn travel will not survive a major crash at that speed. I couldn't care less if they're killed--they're clearly asking for it. It's the innocent bystanders that will inevitably die that concerns me.

WorldMaker 7y ago

This is why I've been finding the splits/differences with Electric Cannonball Runs fascinating. EVs have the added planning skill needed of requiring charging stops (and the related benefit that some "record breaks" over the years are just the addition of a charging stop in the right place). But also, Electric runners seem to have settled a lot more on sticking to posted speed limits, as a gentleman's rule to the game, in part because more EVs make the speed limits clear in GPS displays and in part because some assisted-driving has also infiltrated the EV records. (A lot of drivers using Tesla's cruise control tech.) But also mostly just because there is so much skill and planning in the recharge stops game that speeding isn't necessary for the fun of the sport / ability to break records, because there's plenty of other things to do. I'm not sure that it will last much longer that Electric Cannonball Runs will focus more on speed limit following, but I hope that it does. It's a better sport that way that it is more "gentlemanly".