4 ms·

Yeah, we need a few more years (or more!) before DC fast chargers are mainstream. We need other companies to build them too.

clouddrover 7y ago
Other companies are building them but they're building CCS chargers. Tesla's still using its proprietary plug in North America. Tesla should switch their cars and chargers to CCS (and allow other EVs to use them) to broaden the charging infrastructure for all drivers.
- londons_explore 7y ago
  Current CCS specs are lacking - a 200 Amp limit on DC charging means most EV's can only charge at ~60 kilowatts. The connector is unwieldy and large. The standard doesn't provide the ability for cars to put power into the grid (something that EV makers really want to do because then they can cash in on the lucrative reactive spinning reserve/frequency control market). The connector also doesn't have any way to measure voltage drop across the high current pins, so a bit of dirt could easily cause the whole thing to melt into a gooey mess. I can completely see why Tesla is holding off switching specs until CCS improves or another standard comes to take its place.
  - Reason077 7y ago
    > ”Current CCS specs are lacking - a 200 Amp limit” There is no 200 Amp limit in the modern 150-350 kW CCS chargers being deployed by networks like Ionity and Electrify America. Tesla, of course, already uses CCS in Europe. A Model 3 can charge at over 190 kW on European CCS chargers. A Porsche Taycan (800V), 270 kW.
    - clouddrover 7y ago
      And here's a demonstration of a Tesla Model 3 charging on an Ionity CCS charger: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPrVZtzAqX4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPrVZtzAqX4 Gets up to 499 amps.
  - salawat 7y ago
    Hold up. >reactive spinning reserve/frequency control market What is this? Because if it has anything to do with utilizing software installed at the factory in order to control the fleet of cars as some sort of distributed self metering battery grid to the financial benefit of the EV manufacturer instead of the end customer, I'm calling B.S. It'd be like Smart TV's, but worse.
  - clouddrover 7y ago
    > Current CCS specs are lacking - a 200 Amp limit on DC charging I think your information is out of date. There are 500 amp CCS DC chargers. It's how they get to maximum outputs of 350 kW and 400 kW. > The standard doesn't provide the ability for cars to put power into the grid It's coming: https://www.electrive.com/2019/01/24/charin-bidirectional-charging-with-ccs-standard-by-2025/ https://www.electrive.com/2019/01/24/charin-bidirectional-ch... > Tesla is holding off switching specs until CCS improves Tesla is using CCS plugs in Europe: https://insideevs.com/news/343728/most-tesla-superchargers-now-retrofitted-with-ccs-plugs-in-europe-video/ https://insideevs.com/news/343728/most-tesla-superchargers-n...
  - llukas 7y ago
    Wiki says 80kw for combo 1 connector and 350kw for combo 2 [1]. Why do you bring up ability to put power into the grid? In case of supercharging along the route it would be never the case. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combined_Charging_System https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combined_Charging_System
    - Reason077 7y ago
      No, both the Combo 1 (North America) and Combo 2 (Europe and rest of world) plugs support 350kW. The 80A limitation you’re referring to was in the CCS 1.0 specification, now superseded by CCS 2.0.

clouddrover 7y ago

Other companies are building them but they're building CCS chargers. Tesla's still using its proprietary plug in North America. Tesla should switch their cars and chargers to CCS (and allow other EVs to use them) to broaden the charging infrastructure for all drivers.

londons_explore 7y ago
Current CCS specs are lacking - a 200 Amp limit on DC charging means most EV's can only charge at ~60 kilowatts. The connector is unwieldy and large. The standard doesn't provide the ability for cars to put power into the grid (something that EV makers really want to do because then they can cash in on the lucrative reactive spinning reserve/frequency control market). The connector also doesn't have any way to measure voltage drop across the high current pins, so a bit of dirt could easily cause the whole thing to melt into a gooey mess. I can completely see why Tesla is holding off switching specs until CCS improves or another standard comes to take its place.
- Reason077 7y ago
  > ”Current CCS specs are lacking - a 200 Amp limit” There is no 200 Amp limit in the modern 150-350 kW CCS chargers being deployed by networks like Ionity and Electrify America. Tesla, of course, already uses CCS in Europe. A Model 3 can charge at over 190 kW on European CCS chargers. A Porsche Taycan (800V), 270 kW.
  - clouddrover 7y ago
    And here's a demonstration of a Tesla Model 3 charging on an Ionity CCS charger: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPrVZtzAqX4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPrVZtzAqX4 Gets up to 499 amps.
- salawat 7y ago
  Hold up. >reactive spinning reserve/frequency control market What is this? Because if it has anything to do with utilizing software installed at the factory in order to control the fleet of cars as some sort of distributed self metering battery grid to the financial benefit of the EV manufacturer instead of the end customer, I'm calling B.S. It'd be like Smart TV's, but worse.
- clouddrover 7y ago
  > Current CCS specs are lacking - a 200 Amp limit on DC charging I think your information is out of date. There are 500 amp CCS DC chargers. It's how they get to maximum outputs of 350 kW and 400 kW. > The standard doesn't provide the ability for cars to put power into the grid It's coming: https://www.electrive.com/2019/01/24/charin-bidirectional-charging-with-ccs-standard-by-2025/ https://www.electrive.com/2019/01/24/charin-bidirectional-ch... > Tesla is holding off switching specs until CCS improves Tesla is using CCS plugs in Europe: https://insideevs.com/news/343728/most-tesla-superchargers-now-retrofitted-with-ccs-plugs-in-europe-video/ https://insideevs.com/news/343728/most-tesla-superchargers-n...
- llukas 7y ago
  Wiki says 80kw for combo 1 connector and 350kw for combo 2 [1]. Why do you bring up ability to put power into the grid? In case of supercharging along the route it would be never the case. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combined_Charging_System https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combined_Charging_System
  - Reason077 7y ago
    No, both the Combo 1 (North America) and Combo 2 (Europe and rest of world) plugs support 350kW. The 80A limitation you’re referring to was in the CCS 1.0 specification, now superseded by CCS 2.0.