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I'm around a third of the way through 'The Last Days of the Incas' by Kim MacQuarrie [0]. It's quite a gripping read, trying to wrap your head around how (spoil

I'm around a third of the way through 'The Last Days of the Incas' by Kim MacQuarrie [0]. It's quite a gripping read, trying to wrap your head around how (spoiler? ;) a few hundred Spaniards conquered an empire of millions. Can recommend. [0] https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/354038.The_Last_Days_of_the_Incas https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/354038.The_Last_Days_of_...

29athrowaway 7y ago
The battle of Cajamarca happened during a spiritual retreat after Atahualpa defeated Huascar during the Inca war of succession. The focus of the Spanish was to offer the "requerimiento" and then kidnap the Sapa Inca in order to ask for a ransom.
- photojosh 7y ago
  Yep. But the difference between reading the book and just hearing assorted facts about it is a reminder of why I hated history in my school years.
deleted 7y ago
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s1k3b6 7y ago
They didn't conquer an empire of millions. They conquered the elites. As best as we can tell, from mexico to parts of south america, they expertly pitted groups of native elites against each other and somehow ended up on top. Nobody really knows how or why they were able to succeed. But even more impressive than the conquest is their staying power. The spanish essentially took over the elites and managed to maintain that position for hundreds of years. Take mexico for example. After the spaniards positioned themselves atop mexican society 400+ years ago, they never relinquished that position. Even though ethnic spaniards made up anywhere from 1% to 5% of total mexican population thoughout the 400 years. Even more astounding is that the spaniards used their position atop mexican society to outbreed the native population. 66% of current mexican Y chromosomes are of european ancestry, while 90% of mexican mitochondrial dna comes from native ancestry. Fascinating stuff. The spaniard conquest of central and south america differed markedly from the genocidal conquest of north america which is reflected in the genetic makeup of the populations in the americas.
- 29athrowaway 7y ago
  Most mestizos were illegitimate and did not enjoy the same rights as the Spanish under the casta system.
  - s1k3b6 7y ago
    They were illegimate and didn't enjoy the same rights as full blooded spaniards for sure. But the illegimate male children of spaniards had better mating privileges as nearly two thirds of mexican males have european Y chromosomes. That can't happen without the illegimate male offprings of spaniards having privileges that allowed them to mate at a much higher rate than native males since the full blooded spaniard population was never great enough to produce such drastic genetic disparity. What the privileges and rights were, who knows?
  - spanxx 7y ago
    Do you have any sources on that? As far as I know they had the same rights given by the Crown (legally at least).
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
    - 29athrowaway 7y ago
      Legitimate mestizos enjoyed privileges. Otherwise they had to stay close to their parents. But native women could not represent themselves in court so they could not challenge a Spanish man to recognize their children.
- LessDmesg 7y ago
  > 66% of current mexican Y chromosomes are of european ancestry, while 90% of mexican mitochondrial dna comes from native ancestry That's some damn good virility on the part of Spanish men. Must've been having endless binge coochie-coochie with the local senoritas))
- photojosh 7y ago
  I... was simplifying just a tad? > they expertly pitted groups of native elites against each other In the Andes, they walked right in at the end of a civil war. The Incas had actually established their own empire less than 100 years earlier, and indeed ruled over an estimate 12 million from their tribe of ~100,000, who became the elites. Also interesting; I'm up to the bit where the Spaniards actually have their own little civil war between two of the conquistadors, and not all that far into the conquest. > The spaniard conquest of central and south america differed markedly from the genocidal conquest of north america which is reflected in the genetic makeup of the populations in the americas. Absolutely. Ditto for Australia.

29athrowaway 7y ago

The battle of Cajamarca happened during a spiritual retreat after Atahualpa defeated Huascar during the Inca war of succession. The focus of the Spanish was to offer the "requerimiento" and then kidnap the Sapa Inca in order to ask for a ransom.

photojosh 7y ago
Yep. But the difference between reading the book and just hearing assorted facts about it is a reminder of why I hated history in my school years.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

s1k3b6 7y ago

They didn't conquer an empire of millions. They conquered the elites. As best as we can tell, from mexico to parts of south america, they expertly pitted groups of native elites against each other and somehow ended up on top. Nobody really knows how or why they were able to succeed. But even more impressive than the conquest is their staying power. The spanish essentially took over the elites and managed to maintain that position for hundreds of years. Take mexico for example. After the spaniards positioned themselves atop mexican society 400+ years ago, they never relinquished that position. Even though ethnic spaniards made up anywhere from 1% to 5% of total mexican population thoughout the 400 years. Even more astounding is that the spaniards used their position atop mexican society to outbreed the native population. 66% of current mexican Y chromosomes are of european ancestry, while 90% of mexican mitochondrial dna comes from native ancestry. Fascinating stuff. The spaniard conquest of central and south america differed markedly from the genocidal conquest of north america which is reflected in the genetic makeup of the populations in the americas.

29athrowaway 7y ago
Most mestizos were illegitimate and did not enjoy the same rights as the Spanish under the casta system.
- s1k3b6 7y ago
  They were illegimate and didn't enjoy the same rights as full blooded spaniards for sure. But the illegimate male children of spaniards had better mating privileges as nearly two thirds of mexican males have european Y chromosomes. That can't happen without the illegimate male offprings of spaniards having privileges that allowed them to mate at a much higher rate than native males since the full blooded spaniard population was never great enough to produce such drastic genetic disparity. What the privileges and rights were, who knows?
- spanxx 7y ago
  Do you have any sources on that? As far as I know they had the same rights given by the Crown (legally at least).
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - 29athrowaway 7y ago
    Legitimate mestizos enjoyed privileges. Otherwise they had to stay close to their parents. But native women could not represent themselves in court so they could not challenge a Spanish man to recognize their children.
LessDmesg 7y ago
> 66% of current mexican Y chromosomes are of european ancestry, while 90% of mexican mitochondrial dna comes from native ancestry That's some damn good virility on the part of Spanish men. Must've been having endless binge coochie-coochie with the local senoritas))
photojosh 7y ago
I... was simplifying just a tad? > they expertly pitted groups of native elites against each other In the Andes, they walked right in at the end of a civil war. The Incas had actually established their own empire less than 100 years earlier, and indeed ruled over an estimate 12 million from their tribe of ~100,000, who became the elites. Also interesting; I'm up to the bit where the Spaniards actually have their own little civil war between two of the conquistadors, and not all that far into the conquest. > The spaniard conquest of central and south america differed markedly from the genocidal conquest of north america which is reflected in the genetic makeup of the populations in the americas. Absolutely. Ditto for Australia.