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China basically promised the people who are now in their 40s and 50s benefits that they will not get. This also happened in former Soviet countries. China has

China basically promised the people who are now in their 40s and 50s benefits that they will not get. This also happened in former Soviet countries. China has destroyed some of their environment, trading off building up industry for pollution. This also happened in former Soviet countries.

OldManAndTheCpp 7y ago
Are China's out-sized promises or environmental destruction more egregious than the same problems in the US or UK? The air pollution currently in China is pretty bad, but air pollution goes away pretty quickly after you turn off the coal plants, and oversized promises to pensioners seems like a pretty easy obligation to amend when you have total control over the state.
- rm_-rf_slash 7y ago
  Where’s the money gonna come from? We’re talking eventually hundreds of millions of retirees. That’s never happened in human history before. If making good on pension promises was easy, the CCP would have done it by now.
coldtea 7y ago
>China basically promised the people who are now in their 40s and 50s benefits that they will not get. So just like the west with stagnant wages and pension systems in free fall, while healthcare, education, housing, student debt, etc rises?
wazoox 7y ago
You mean like lifting more than 300 millions people out of dire poverty? Chinese in their 40s and 50s rabidly defend their government, because it delivered. I bemoan lack of democracy, Xinjiang repression, pollution and all the rest; but the fact is that the past 30 years have been a success of unseen proportions for China.
- shrubble 7y ago
  After the Cultural Revolution and after the Four Pests Campaign, there wasn't any other direction to go than up, for those who were still alive, that is. The Chinese were made poor by the Communist party and only rescued by moving away from the doctrine to something else.
- novok 7y ago
  And the ones in their 60s remember half their family dying from the famine when they were children, especially the villagers who moved out. When you live in a country where any negative expression will get you killed, arrested, etc. You quickly only hear the positive voices.
seamyb88 7y ago
If you're going to (try to) attack Communism as an ideology, try criticising states who actually organise themselves in accordance with Communist ideology. China and (Stalin's) Soviet Union are not examples of such. There are more Billionaires in Beijing than in London. You have criticised a Capitalist country.

OldManAndTheCpp 7y ago

Are China's out-sized promises or environmental destruction more egregious than the same problems in the US or UK? The air pollution currently in China is pretty bad, but air pollution goes away pretty quickly after you turn off the coal plants, and oversized promises to pensioners seems like a pretty easy obligation to amend when you have total control over the state.

rm_-rf_slash 7y ago
Where’s the money gonna come from? We’re talking eventually hundreds of millions of retirees. That’s never happened in human history before. If making good on pension promises was easy, the CCP would have done it by now.

coldtea 7y ago

>China basically promised the people who are now in their 40s and 50s benefits that they will not get. So just like the west with stagnant wages and pension systems in free fall, while healthcare, education, housing, student debt, etc rises?

wazoox 7y ago

You mean like lifting more than 300 millions people out of dire poverty? Chinese in their 40s and 50s rabidly defend their government, because it delivered. I bemoan lack of democracy, Xinjiang repression, pollution and all the rest; but the fact is that the past 30 years have been a success of unseen proportions for China.

shrubble 7y ago
After the Cultural Revolution and after the Four Pests Campaign, there wasn't any other direction to go than up, for those who were still alive, that is. The Chinese were made poor by the Communist party and only rescued by moving away from the doctrine to something else.
novok 7y ago
And the ones in their 60s remember half their family dying from the famine when they were children, especially the villagers who moved out. When you live in a country where any negative expression will get you killed, arrested, etc. You quickly only hear the positive voices.

seamyb88 7y ago

If you're going to (try to) attack Communism as an ideology, try criticising states who actually organise themselves in accordance with Communist ideology. China and (Stalin's) Soviet Union are not examples of such. There are more Billionaires in Beijing than in London. You have criticised a Capitalist country.