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Look at Germany. It’s a better experiment. Former democratic part got billions from westerners and didn’t evolve far. They got basically new infrastructure buil

by lnsru 7y ago

Look at Germany. It’s a better experiment. Former democratic part got billions from westerners and didn’t evolve far. They got basically new infrastructure build from western money, but people left former communistic paradise. Salary gap is still huge. That’s why Tesla picked location there and not in the western part of the country.

TulliusCicero 7y ago
The US has similar variation in GDP per capita in its states, despite having had essentially the same economic system at least back to the civil war over 150 years ago.
jogundas 7y ago
A much more nuanced story can be told about Germany, see eg https://www.economist.com/europe/2019/10/31/germans-still-dont-agree-on-what-reunification-meant https://www.economist.com/europe/2019/10/31/germans-still-do... . When it comes to the Tesla factory, it will be right outside Berlin https://www.dw.com/en/tesla-factory-outside-berlin-to-cost-4-billion/a-51286353 https://www.dw.com/en/tesla-factory-outside-berlin-to-cost-4... .
- ben_w 7y ago
  Berlin is in the east of Germany. I live in Berlin, and have considered cycling to Poland and back as a day trip. One of my German coworkers remarks often that wages for any given job in former-DDR-areas are much lower than the same jobs in pre-reunification-Bundesrepublik-Deutschland-areas.
  - swebs 7y ago
    Berlin was both. Hence why they had to build the wall.
    - ben_w 7y ago
      Yes, but the Tesla factory is “just outside” Berlin, so I didn’t feel that detail was important in this case.
    - IndrekR 7y ago
      West Berlin was a political enclave in DDR. ~150 km from the inner German border [1]. Just outside Berlin is pretty much ex-DDR territory. At the same time Berlin does have quite a strong foreign community and high migration, lately negative for Germans and positive for other ethnic groups [2]. It is the second largest city (by population) in Europe after London with much lower living costs [3]. Also Daimler and BMW have strong presence in Berlin. Those factors may have influenced the Tesla's decision a lot. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inner_German_border https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inner_German_border [2] https://www.statistik-berlin-brandenburg.de/produkte/kleinestatistik/AP_KleineStatistik_EN_2018_BE.pdf https://www.statistik-berlin-brandenburg.de/produkte/kleines... [3] https://teleport.org/compare/berlin-and-london/ https://teleport.org/compare/berlin-and-london/

by lnsru 7y ago

TulliusCicero 7y ago

The US has similar variation in GDP per capita in its states, despite having had essentially the same economic system at least back to the civil war over 150 years ago.

jogundas 7y ago

A much more nuanced story can be told about Germany, see eg https://www.economist.com/europe/2019/10/31/germans-still-dont-agree-on-what-reunification-meant https://www.economist.com/europe/2019/10/31/germans-still-do... . When it comes to the Tesla factory, it will be right outside Berlin https://www.dw.com/en/tesla-factory-outside-berlin-to-cost-4-billion/a-51286353 https://www.dw.com/en/tesla-factory-outside-berlin-to-cost-4... .

ben_w 7y ago
Berlin is in the east of Germany. I live in Berlin, and have considered cycling to Poland and back as a day trip. One of my German coworkers remarks often that wages for any given job in former-DDR-areas are much lower than the same jobs in pre-reunification-Bundesrepublik-Deutschland-areas.
- swebs 7y ago
  Berlin was both. Hence why they had to build the wall.
  - ben_w 7y ago
    Yes, but the Tesla factory is “just outside” Berlin, so I didn’t feel that detail was important in this case.
  - IndrekR 7y ago
    West Berlin was a political enclave in DDR. ~150 km from the inner German border [1]. Just outside Berlin is pretty much ex-DDR territory. At the same time Berlin does have quite a strong foreign community and high migration, lately negative for Germans and positive for other ethnic groups [2]. It is the second largest city (by population) in Europe after London with much lower living costs [3]. Also Daimler and BMW have strong presence in Berlin. Those factors may have influenced the Tesla's decision a lot. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inner_German_border https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inner_German_border [2] https://www.statistik-berlin-brandenburg.de/produkte/kleinestatistik/AP_KleineStatistik_EN_2018_BE.pdf https://www.statistik-berlin-brandenburg.de/produkte/kleines... [3] https://teleport.org/compare/berlin-and-london/ https://teleport.org/compare/berlin-and-london/