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I think there's interesting stuff here but it's a stretch to extend this small sample size study to an effect that is probably as much gamesmanship as temporal

I think there's interesting stuff here but it's a stretch to extend this small sample size study to an effect that is probably as much gamesmanship as temporal perception. Anecdotally most of the time when a ball goes out of bounds both parties have a good sense of last touch and it's often validated by the third parties. NBA players are ultimately trying to retain possession for their team and can make a situation seem more convincing. Same can apply to NFL players thinking they've made a catch our any number of split second mental evaluations. The bias would be resolved by the time there would be a reaction. In other words I believe in the abstract the temporal bias but see no reason to apply it to out of bounds calls in the NBA other than the temporal bias of click bait :)

everdev 7y ago
> Anecdotally most of the time when a ball goes out of bounds both parties have a good sense of last touch and it's often validated by the third parties In friendly pickup games it's extremely rare to see any confusion about who touched it last. As competition heats up it's more common (but still rare) and almost exclusively limited to those who are playing most aggressively / competitively. I'd put money on this phenomenon bring related to the desire to win. We see this in politics, arguments and other sports calls (that don't involve touch, like if a ball touched a line) as well where the desire to win seems to create a conscious or subconscious blind spot that allows us to be extremely confident in things that would benefit us regardless of the information provided to us. And again I wouldn't be surprised if this phenomenon increases or decreases based on how badly we want to win.
- gmueckl 7y ago
  Don't professional games generally have a faster pace? If so, that might be a factor.
  - everdev 7y ago
    Yes, but you can see this with kids competing too. Their desire to win seems inversely proportional to their honesty or rational observation of a call, to the point where it seems like they believe their slanted viewpoint and beyond just trying to manipulate the ref.
milesvp 7y ago
You may be right that this is a stretch to apply to any one phenomenon, but from my studies on conciousness the findings of this paper are consistent with most of what I’ve seen. Basically the brain sort of tells us stories constantly and consciousness is more of an after effect. There was an explosion in the field of neuroscience with the high avalability of FMRI devices. The big experiment that seems to be repeatable is telling someone to make a desicion while watching their brain, and the watcher could predict the decision ahead before the decider had signaled their decision. Some experiments seemed to go further and show the brain made the decision before the person was aware of their decision.

everdev 7y ago

> Anecdotally most of the time when a ball goes out of bounds both parties have a good sense of last touch and it's often validated by the third parties In friendly pickup games it's extremely rare to see any confusion about who touched it last. As competition heats up it's more common (but still rare) and almost exclusively limited to those who are playing most aggressively / competitively. I'd put money on this phenomenon bring related to the desire to win. We see this in politics, arguments and other sports calls (that don't involve touch, like if a ball touched a line) as well where the desire to win seems to create a conscious or subconscious blind spot that allows us to be extremely confident in things that would benefit us regardless of the information provided to us. And again I wouldn't be surprised if this phenomenon increases or decreases based on how badly we want to win.

gmueckl 7y ago
Don't professional games generally have a faster pace? If so, that might be a factor.
- everdev 7y ago
  Yes, but you can see this with kids competing too. Their desire to win seems inversely proportional to their honesty or rational observation of a call, to the point where it seems like they believe their slanted viewpoint and beyond just trying to manipulate the ref.

milesvp 7y ago

You may be right that this is a stretch to apply to any one phenomenon, but from my studies on conciousness the findings of this paper are consistent with most of what I’ve seen. Basically the brain sort of tells us stories constantly and consciousness is more of an after effect. There was an explosion in the field of neuroscience with the high avalability of FMRI devices. The big experiment that seems to be repeatable is telling someone to make a desicion while watching their brain, and the watcher could predict the decision ahead before the decider had signaled their decision. Some experiments seemed to go further and show the brain made the decision before the person was aware of their decision.