8 ms·

They should've put this note at the very top of the page: "Mac OS only for now!". What is the point of promoting this to everyone at this stage?

asutekku 7y ago
Why not? A huge portion of developers uses Macs and windows support is coming at some point. Better to get an actual feedback from the developers.
- bflesch 7y ago
  How about linux users?
  - jackcodes 7y ago
    You’ve got to accept the fact they want to collect feedback from other users first and not you.
    - madeofpalk 7y ago
      From some users first, even if that doesn't include you
      - hinkley 7y ago
        No, specifically him. I’ve heard talk. I dunno what he did but he should apologize already.
  - kibwen 7y ago
    Extremely featureful debuggers such as this one tend to require a great deal of code that is hardware-specific, in addition to being OS-specific. I assume MacOS was targeted first because it's the platform with the greatest degree of hardware uniformity. I fully expect Linux support to materialize someday, but with the caveat that I expect it will only (officially) work with the most popular hardware.
    - jasonlaster11 7y ago
      That's right. The only way to have a performant recording is to capture the browser's OS system calls in the recording. This unfortunately makes the feature quite OS specific. https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/recordreplay/ProcessRedirectDarwin.cpp#52-76 https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/recordr... Replay is currently in the user-research validation phase. We care about cross platform support and will prioritize it when we are ready to commit to the feature.
- fireattack 7y ago
  People on HN don't seem to like it when some other companies start their product from one platform.
  - _coveredInBees 7y ago
    Nor do they like it when they do support all platforms from day one via an Electron app...
    - barkingcat 7y ago
      People on HN don't like anything.
      - XaspR8d 7y ago
        Speaking of which, I'm a little shocked to see a Mozilla thread that doesn't yet mention Pocket or the rebranding or DoH. That must mean we are in a good mood?
        depr 7y ago
        No, just too busy talking about Linux on desktop!
        request_id 7y ago
        We're busy prepping to argue about UBI at Thanksgiving dinner.
        sigspec 7y ago
        Oh man. Now I really want to tell the wife to turn the car around.
      - ddingus 7y ago
        Other people on HN like some things.
      - 7y ago
- anoncake 7y ago
  One would expect an organization dedicated to freedom to prioritize Linux support.
  - Seirdy 7y ago
    Mozilla has implemented DRM support in Firefox. I think Mozilla is more concerned with reducing dependence on nonfree software than supporting free software. Just to clarify, I don't fault Mozilla for having that attitude, but that doesn't mean I prefer it. I would prefer that they prioritize FOSS platforms like Linux and \*BSD, as well as getting Firefox on platforms like Plasma Mobile, PostmarketOS, and other GNU/Linux-based mobile operating systems. Developer adoption is a necessary (but probably not sufficient) precondition for general adoption, which is why developing for these platforms is important even though they are new/unpopular.
majortennis 7y ago
I can see some form of replay in firefox dev edition on windows
martius 7y ago
This project is advertised on its own domain (not a mozilla.org subdomain) and there's no header/footer/link to mozilla.org. This makes me think that it's not a feature on the roadmap of firefox sponsored by Mozilla, but an experimentation/side project.
- nebulous1 7y ago
  The fact that it's in Firefox Nightly seems to blow that hypothesis out of the water
- Vinnl 7y ago
  I can't really tell whether this is an official Mozilla website (though it looks like one), but the feature is certainly an official one on the roadmap. See this earlier discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17624709 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17624709
JeremyNT 7y ago
Is there some technical reason it's only for os x? I'm not really upset they targeted Macs first but I am a bit curious why they felt a need to.
- wolco 7y ago
  Small user base to test?
  - hbosch 7y ago
    Actually probably Mozilla’s largest user base
    - ken 7y ago
      Why 'probably'? According to the stats I could find [1], Firefox has around 5% of Mac users, and around 9% of Windows users. Windows is Firefox's biggest platform, both in absolute terms and as a fraction of that platform's users. On Linux, Firefox has a bigger percentage (>30%), but (desktop) Linux is much less popular than macOS so in absolute terms they have the fewest users there. [1]: https://netmarketshare.com/ https://netmarketshare.com/
      - Seirdy 7y ago
        I'm really disappointed that Linux gets less attention from FOSS-supportive organizations like Mozilla. Desktop Linux adoption is a catch-22: people don't use it because it doesn't have as much software; however, it has less software because it's less popular.
        bscphil 7y ago
        Yep. It's noteworthy that over 10% of Mozilla's users are on Linux. [1] And presumably that only includes users who submit the hardware report. That's a huge portion for any cross-platform application. It's genuinely rather surprising that they don't give it more attention simply because it's a large portion of their user base, and because Linux users are more likely to submit bug reports and patches. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21660399 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21660399
jasonlaster11 7y ago
Team member here. Firefox Replay is currently in user research phase while we validate it. Cross platform support will absolutely be a priority when Replay is on the official roadmap. Thanks for the feedback, firefox-replay.com is also a work in progress. We did not plan an official release today. We'll be sure to make the Mac OS limitation more clear. Here is some more context on the mac specific functionality (https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/recordreplay/ProcessRedirectDarwin.cpp#52-76 https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/recordr...).
- bhauer 7y ago
  Thanks for the clarification and for building this great-sounding tool. I'm really looking forward to trying this out on Windows!
- rckclmbr 7y ago
  > Firefox Replay is currently in user research phase while we validate it A question about how you develop / roll this out. Do you keep the code private, or do you commit it to the open source repo as you're working with a small amount high touch users? I guess the question is do you want a full working product when you open source it? Do you tie your PR / forum posts with publicly shipping the source code? Or is all development out in the open?
  - jasonlaster11 7y ago
    Good question. Everything is in firefox and open source Here are the bugs: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/buglist.cgi?cmdtype=runnamed&namedcmd=WebReplay https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/buglist.cgi?cmdtype=runnamed&na... Here's the primary directory: https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/recordreplay https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/recordr... The debugger API is implemented in JS here https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/devtools/server/actors/replay/debugger.js https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/devtools/server...
- imvetri 7y ago
  What benefits it provides than record and playback using a screen recorder?

asutekku 7y ago

Why not? A huge portion of developers uses Macs and windows support is coming at some point. Better to get an actual feedback from the developers.

bflesch 7y ago
How about linux users?
- jackcodes 7y ago
  You’ve got to accept the fact they want to collect feedback from other users first and not you.
  - madeofpalk 7y ago
    From some users first, even if that doesn't include you
    - hinkley 7y ago
      No, specifically him. I’ve heard talk. I dunno what he did but he should apologize already.
- kibwen 7y ago
  Extremely featureful debuggers such as this one tend to require a great deal of code that is hardware-specific, in addition to being OS-specific. I assume MacOS was targeted first because it's the platform with the greatest degree of hardware uniformity. I fully expect Linux support to materialize someday, but with the caveat that I expect it will only (officially) work with the most popular hardware.
  - jasonlaster11 7y ago
    That's right. The only way to have a performant recording is to capture the browser's OS system calls in the recording. This unfortunately makes the feature quite OS specific. https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/recordreplay/ProcessRedirectDarwin.cpp#52-76 https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/recordr... Replay is currently in the user-research validation phase. We care about cross platform support and will prioritize it when we are ready to commit to the feature.
fireattack 7y ago
People on HN don't seem to like it when some other companies start their product from one platform.
- _coveredInBees 7y ago
  Nor do they like it when they do support all platforms from day one via an Electron app...
  - barkingcat 7y ago
    People on HN don't like anything.
    - XaspR8d 7y ago
      Speaking of which, I'm a little shocked to see a Mozilla thread that doesn't yet mention Pocket or the rebranding or DoH. That must mean we are in a good mood?
      - depr 7y ago
        No, just too busy talking about Linux on desktop!
      - request_id 7y ago
        We're busy prepping to argue about UBI at Thanksgiving dinner.
        sigspec 7y ago
        Oh man. Now I really want to tell the wife to turn the car around.
    - ddingus 7y ago
      Other people on HN like some things.
    - 7y ago
anoncake 7y ago
One would expect an organization dedicated to freedom to prioritize Linux support.
- Seirdy 7y ago
  Mozilla has implemented DRM support in Firefox. I think Mozilla is more concerned with reducing dependence on nonfree software than supporting free software. Just to clarify, I don't fault Mozilla for having that attitude, but that doesn't mean I prefer it. I would prefer that they prioritize FOSS platforms like Linux and \*BSD, as well as getting Firefox on platforms like Plasma Mobile, PostmarketOS, and other GNU/Linux-based mobile operating systems. Developer adoption is a necessary (but probably not sufficient) precondition for general adoption, which is why developing for these platforms is important even though they are new/unpopular.

majortennis 7y ago

I can see some form of replay in firefox dev edition on windows

martius 7y ago

This project is advertised on its own domain (not a mozilla.org subdomain) and there's no header/footer/link to mozilla.org. This makes me think that it's not a feature on the roadmap of firefox sponsored by Mozilla, but an experimentation/side project.

nebulous1 7y ago
The fact that it's in Firefox Nightly seems to blow that hypothesis out of the water
Vinnl 7y ago
I can't really tell whether this is an official Mozilla website (though it looks like one), but the feature is certainly an official one on the roadmap. See this earlier discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17624709 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17624709

JeremyNT 7y ago

Is there some technical reason it's only for os x? I'm not really upset they targeted Macs first but I am a bit curious why they felt a need to.

wolco 7y ago
Small user base to test?
- hbosch 7y ago
  Actually probably Mozilla’s largest user base
  - ken 7y ago
    Why 'probably'? According to the stats I could find [1], Firefox has around 5% of Mac users, and around 9% of Windows users. Windows is Firefox's biggest platform, both in absolute terms and as a fraction of that platform's users. On Linux, Firefox has a bigger percentage (>30%), but (desktop) Linux is much less popular than macOS so in absolute terms they have the fewest users there. [1]: https://netmarketshare.com/ https://netmarketshare.com/
    - Seirdy 7y ago
      I'm really disappointed that Linux gets less attention from FOSS-supportive organizations like Mozilla. Desktop Linux adoption is a catch-22: people don't use it because it doesn't have as much software; however, it has less software because it's less popular.
      - bscphil 7y ago
        Yep. It's noteworthy that over 10% of Mozilla's users are on Linux. [1] And presumably that only includes users who submit the hardware report. That's a huge portion for any cross-platform application. It's genuinely rather surprising that they don't give it more attention simply because it's a large portion of their user base, and because Linux users are more likely to submit bug reports and patches. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21660399 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21660399

jasonlaster11 7y ago

Team member here. Firefox Replay is currently in user research phase while we validate it. Cross platform support will absolutely be a priority when Replay is on the official roadmap. Thanks for the feedback, firefox-replay.com is also a work in progress. We did not plan an official release today. We'll be sure to make the Mac OS limitation more clear. Here is some more context on the mac specific functionality (https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/recordreplay/ProcessRedirectDarwin.cpp#52-76 https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/recordr...).

bhauer 7y ago
Thanks for the clarification and for building this great-sounding tool. I'm really looking forward to trying this out on Windows!
rckclmbr 7y ago
> Firefox Replay is currently in user research phase while we validate it A question about how you develop / roll this out. Do you keep the code private, or do you commit it to the open source repo as you're working with a small amount high touch users? I guess the question is do you want a full working product when you open source it? Do you tie your PR / forum posts with publicly shipping the source code? Or is all development out in the open?
- jasonlaster11 7y ago
  Good question. Everything is in firefox and open source Here are the bugs: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/buglist.cgi?cmdtype=runnamed&namedcmd=WebReplay https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/buglist.cgi?cmdtype=runnamed&na... Here's the primary directory: https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/recordreplay https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/recordr... The debugger API is implemented in JS here https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/devtools/server/actors/replay/debugger.js https://searchfox.org/mozilla-central/source/devtools/server...
imvetri 7y ago
What benefits it provides than record and playback using a screen recorder?