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Python had one: https://morepypy.blogspot.com/2016/07/reverse-debugging-for-python.html?m=1 https://morepypy.blogspot.com/2016/07/reverse-debugging-for-... Ne

Python had one: https://morepypy.blogspot.com/2016/07/reverse-debugging-for-python.html?m=1 https://morepypy.blogspot.com/2016/07/reverse-debugging-for-... Never got popular enough to be ported to cpython, let alone python 3. It's no surprise though: my experience is that most python devs don't know how to use a debugger. In fact, the huge majority of tutorials to learn python don't include one, nor they give explanation about python -m, venv, pip, the python path and other very important basis. Even the people using pdb don't know very important commands like until, jump, up or tbreak.

maest 7y ago
Jupyter notebooks are also hilariously debug-unfriendly.
- BiteCode_dev 7y ago
  Pdb works fine in notebooks though, and that's one of the numerous reasons students should learn it first, before any GUI debugger.
  - missjellyfish 7y ago
    That implies that students don‘t stop listening as soon as anyone mentions command line. Those who desperately need a debugger to learn are the first ones to not use it because of no GUI.
- prennert 7y ago
  Wait what? Do you know about the %debug magic? It is the best thing ever, particularly when prototyping in the notebook which keeps most of the state. I saw Fernando Pérez use it in a YouTube video. Shame I cannot find it anymore. He was saying he debugs his code only by placing 1/0 in the part of the code he wants to inspect. After the exception is thrown %debug allows you to step into the stack and explore it via a repl. I found that crazy and tried it it. It is life changing. That's how I debug my python code for years now.
  - maest 7y ago
    Expecting users to sprinkle 1/0 through their code is arguably what I mean by "debug unfriendly".
Iv 7y ago
Maybe that's because of the different kind of work I do with but I have wrestled, frustrated at some bugs hard to spot with gdb, but I never felt retrained by pudb despite it being, I guess, more limited. All the bugs I had in python were easier to reproduce, probably because it provides less rope than C or C++ to hang yourself. Usually, stopping a bit before the exception, exploring the variable states was enough to spot the bug. Isn't there something about garbage-collected, dynamic-types, GIL-constrained languages that makes their typical bug easier to spot with a more limited debugger?
cik 7y ago
It's sad really. I gave a talk a year ago on debugging with the pdb, the basics. Turns out I was the only developer who had ever used the pdb as opposed to bucket listing it.
- chillingeffect 7y ago
  same with arduino. breaking from pro emedded work to Arduino for some just for fun projs, im flummoxed wo my debuggers and astonished how unfamiliar the community is!
  - cik 7y ago
    User name checked out ;)

maest 7y ago

Jupyter notebooks are also hilariously debug-unfriendly.

BiteCode_dev 7y ago
Pdb works fine in notebooks though, and that's one of the numerous reasons students should learn it first, before any GUI debugger.
- missjellyfish 7y ago
  That implies that students don‘t stop listening as soon as anyone mentions command line. Those who desperately need a debugger to learn are the first ones to not use it because of no GUI.
prennert 7y ago
Wait what? Do you know about the %debug magic? It is the best thing ever, particularly when prototyping in the notebook which keeps most of the state. I saw Fernando Pérez use it in a YouTube video. Shame I cannot find it anymore. He was saying he debugs his code only by placing 1/0 in the part of the code he wants to inspect. After the exception is thrown %debug allows you to step into the stack and explore it via a repl. I found that crazy and tried it it. It is life changing. That's how I debug my python code for years now.
- maest 7y ago
  Expecting users to sprinkle 1/0 through their code is arguably what I mean by "debug unfriendly".

Iv 7y ago

Maybe that's because of the different kind of work I do with but I have wrestled, frustrated at some bugs hard to spot with gdb, but I never felt retrained by pudb despite it being, I guess, more limited. All the bugs I had in python were easier to reproduce, probably because it provides less rope than C or C++ to hang yourself. Usually, stopping a bit before the exception, exploring the variable states was enough to spot the bug. Isn't there something about garbage-collected, dynamic-types, GIL-constrained languages that makes their typical bug easier to spot with a more limited debugger?

cik 7y ago

It's sad really. I gave a talk a year ago on debugging with the pdb, the basics. Turns out I was the only developer who had ever used the pdb as opposed to bucket listing it.

chillingeffect 7y ago
same with arduino. breaking from pro emedded work to Arduino for some just for fun projs, im flummoxed wo my debuggers and astonished how unfamiliar the community is!
- cik 7y ago
  User name checked out ;)