5 ms·

This is the down-side of artificial scarcity for software. The upside is that sweet sweet green. If you could remain cynical a few years longer, scrimp and save

This is the down-side of artificial scarcity for software. The upside is that sweet sweet green. If you could remain cynical a few years longer, scrimp and save like 10 years of a comfy mid 6 figure salary, you'd stop caring about the BS, and you'd might even learn to love it (or even contribute to it!) After all, nothing quite feels as good as being a well-paid expert in a complicated field, especially when it grows more complicated over time. It's offensive, and it's not how it should be, it's a "defect/defect" Nash equilibrium when we should be going for "cooperate/cooperate". So kudos to you for fighting the good fight - you deserve to win.

ailideex 7y ago
> artificial scarcity for software Can you elaborate on this? Why would you say there is artificial scarcity for software?
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- prawn 7y ago
  I assume they're talking about the fact that software can be replicated at no cost but is constrained by pricepoints, encrypted code, licensing agreements, versioning flags, and so on. It's been artificially constrained in code.
  - javajosh 7y ago
    Correct. Although the constraints often involve code, they don't have to. Enterprise license agreements are ultimately enforced with threat of legal action, coin-op arcade games by a physical mechanism, for example.
- javajosh 7y ago
  Software costs ~0 to copy and distribute absolutely perfect copies, world-wide. To drive the price up you create artificial scarcity, mostly rooted in IP law. Important note for HN readers: 'driving the price up' is a net benefit for programmers. Artificial scarcity is why you get paid big bucks. Interestingly, data is legitimately scarce. But that's a discussion for another time...
  - rumanator 7y ago
    Copy and distribution costs are just a part of the cost. Development and maintenance does require real flesh and blood people spending their days working on developing, building, and deployment. That part costs money.
    - javajosh 7y ago
      You tacitly assume that I am not aware that software products have an R&D cost, and you are (insultingly) wrong. Of course they do. And without artificial scarcity that R&D cost will not be recouped. The default state of software is an open source model, where the "developing, building, and deployment" doesn't cost money because there isn't any.
      - saberdancer 7y ago
        Copy and distribution costs for movies in a digital age are non existant. Are movies using artificial scarcity?
        javajosh 7y ago
        Yes.
        BlueTemplar 7y ago
        That movies are almost impossible to buy DRM-free should give you a hint ?
    - bayesian_horse 7y ago
      The artificial scarcity applies to copies of an individual piece of software, rather than the scarcity of different pieces of software. Once you build it, almost the only way to achieve scarcity is through IP law.
  - hos234 7y ago
    There is a ton of free software. Price is not up just because of IP law. It's up because running and maintaining Wikipedia for example has a price even though most of the stack is free.
thrownawayalrea 7y ago
What about those of us who don't get crazy compensations, but instead work at a midsized company selling a "security" product? All of the complexity in my field comes from stupidity, either by certifiers, or legacy protocols that can't die or sales people playing "defect/defect" with oneanother so nobody fucking talks with each other. If the complexity at least came from software I would have a reason for my knowledge to feel valuable outside my specific domain.
- javajosh 7y ago
  Well, it sounds like you need to be learning things outside your domain in the hopes of entering the job market. Sometimes you can't fix the game. BTW I'm quite wary of "security products" for enterprise; it reeks of antivirus software writ large. That said I can see some benefit to services like audits, or even things like honey pots or "dark net scans" for detecting leaks. But something tells me that's not what you're talking about...
  - thrownawayalrea 7y ago
    > BTW I'm quite wary of "security products" for enterprise; it reeks of antivirus software writ large. That said I can see some benefit to services like audits, or even things like honey pots or "dark net scans" for detecting leaks. But something tells me that's not what you're talking about... The product itself is quite reasonable on paper [1]. (And, yes, it would provide value even if all of the software industry would ramp up their security practices, so it's not a band aid like antivirus software.) The execution is the problem. Despise selling "nation state attacker secure" appliances, we are not internally focusing on producing a high security product but give priority to certifications and features. The disconnect between marketed identity and day-to-day developer experience is breathtakingly depressing... at least to those of us who have an interest in security. Management doesn't care of course. It sells (because of certification and little alternatives on the market), so all is well. [1] Sorry for being so vague. Given the set of statements I've given already, anything more would make me personally identifiable to my coworkers.
- scarejunba 7y ago

ailideex 7y ago

> artificial scarcity for software Can you elaborate on this? Why would you say there is artificial scarcity for software?

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
prawn 7y ago
I assume they're talking about the fact that software can be replicated at no cost but is constrained by pricepoints, encrypted code, licensing agreements, versioning flags, and so on. It's been artificially constrained in code.
- javajosh 7y ago
  Correct. Although the constraints often involve code, they don't have to. Enterprise license agreements are ultimately enforced with threat of legal action, coin-op arcade games by a physical mechanism, for example.
javajosh 7y ago
Software costs ~0 to copy and distribute absolutely perfect copies, world-wide. To drive the price up you create artificial scarcity, mostly rooted in IP law. Important note for HN readers: 'driving the price up' is a net benefit for programmers. Artificial scarcity is why you get paid big bucks. Interestingly, data is legitimately scarce. But that's a discussion for another time...
- rumanator 7y ago
  Copy and distribution costs are just a part of the cost. Development and maintenance does require real flesh and blood people spending their days working on developing, building, and deployment. That part costs money.
  - javajosh 7y ago
    You tacitly assume that I am not aware that software products have an R&D cost, and you are (insultingly) wrong. Of course they do. And without artificial scarcity that R&D cost will not be recouped. The default state of software is an open source model, where the "developing, building, and deployment" doesn't cost money because there isn't any.
    - saberdancer 7y ago
      Copy and distribution costs for movies in a digital age are non existant. Are movies using artificial scarcity?
      - javajosh 7y ago
        Yes.
      - BlueTemplar 7y ago
        That movies are almost impossible to buy DRM-free should give you a hint ?
  - bayesian_horse 7y ago
    The artificial scarcity applies to copies of an individual piece of software, rather than the scarcity of different pieces of software. Once you build it, almost the only way to achieve scarcity is through IP law.
- hos234 7y ago
  There is a ton of free software. Price is not up just because of IP law. It's up because running and maintaining Wikipedia for example has a price even though most of the stack is free.

thrownawayalrea 7y ago

What about those of us who don't get crazy compensations, but instead work at a midsized company selling a "security" product? All of the complexity in my field comes from stupidity, either by certifiers, or legacy protocols that can't die or sales people playing "defect/defect" with oneanother so nobody fucking talks with each other. If the complexity at least came from software I would have a reason for my knowledge to feel valuable outside my specific domain.

javajosh 7y ago
Well, it sounds like you need to be learning things outside your domain in the hopes of entering the job market. Sometimes you can't fix the game. BTW I'm quite wary of "security products" for enterprise; it reeks of antivirus software writ large. That said I can see some benefit to services like audits, or even things like honey pots or "dark net scans" for detecting leaks. But something tells me that's not what you're talking about...
- thrownawayalrea 7y ago
  > BTW I'm quite wary of "security products" for enterprise; it reeks of antivirus software writ large. That said I can see some benefit to services like audits, or even things like honey pots or "dark net scans" for detecting leaks. But something tells me that's not what you're talking about... The product itself is quite reasonable on paper [1]. (And, yes, it would provide value even if all of the software industry would ramp up their security practices, so it's not a band aid like antivirus software.) The execution is the problem. Despise selling "nation state attacker secure" appliances, we are not internally focusing on producing a high security product but give priority to certifications and features. The disconnect between marketed identity and day-to-day developer experience is breathtakingly depressing... at least to those of us who have an interest in security. Management doesn't care of course. It sells (because of certification and little alternatives on the market), so all is well. [1] Sorry for being so vague. Given the set of statements I've given already, anything more would make me personally identifiable to my coworkers.
scarejunba 7y ago