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Great work. Let over politicized countries fight each other while the rest of the world moves ahead. >“The Chinese Communist Party is trying to circumvent our

Great work. Let over politicized countries fight each other while the rest of the world moves ahead. >“The Chinese Communist Party is trying to circumvent our export control system to support national security threats like Huawei - we cannot let it succeed,” Representative Mike Gallagher, a Republican from Wisconsin, told Reuters. I mean, one cannot make this more obvious. The rest of the world really doesn't want to be subservient to US paranoia

pnako 7y ago
The rest of the world is doing the exact same thing. Sovereign nations should control their own technical infrastructure and not rely on American, Chinese, Russian or European technology. Open source is certainly a big step in the right direction toward a world where we can better rely on technology. But we're not there yet, when it comes to hardware.
tanilama 7y ago
Yep Truth is, no one can stop any one doing anything. Free market can dissuade your competitors from creating their own supply chain because that won't make economical sense. But once that illusion is gone, the ones that are getting hurt is the current market leaders.
onepointsixC 7y ago
Ah yes, let's do business without concerns of morality. Make western funded technology available CCP SOE's. After all, they gotta power their "exciting" and "innovative"[1] algorithms with some sort of architecture. Less we miss anyone[2]. [1]https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2019/11/12/chinese-firm-sold-cctv-cameras-nhs-advertised-racial-profiling/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2019/11/12/chinese-firm... [2]:https://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2019/sep/23/footage-blindfolded-shackled-prisoners-china-video https://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2019/sep/23/footage-...
- wayoutthere 7y ago
  Morality is simply "things I like" and "things I don't like". It's not a good basis for policy, especially when moral standards vary significantly between individuals. It's a fool's errand to try to impose your morals on another person as if they were somehow superior (though that arrogance is the foundation of the American psyche). You literally just can't.
  - riversflow 7y ago
    There are such things as universal human rights, and China is absolute violating of them. >You literally just can't. Right, which is why we let Hitler exterminate the Jews.
    - wayoutthere 7y ago
      > There are such things as universal human rights, and China is absolute violation of them. You mean the ones that the US routinely violates for "terrorists" and "criminals"? China uses the exact same rhetoric for the people whose rights it violates. The situation with the Uyghurs mirrors a lot of the tactics used in the 70s by American police against black Americans under the guise of the "war on drugs" (hint: our police and prison guards were way more abusive than many people realize). > Right, which is why we let Hitler exterminate the Jews. What else could we have done? Anti-semitism was considered morally acceptable at the time. The American people were completely against the war until Pearl Harbor. Then we locked anyone who looked Japanese or spoke German up in camps. What we were doing was the exact same thing Hitler said he was doing with the Jews. Obviously in hindsight Hitler was awful and the Holocaust was frighteningly real. But the extent of the Holocaust was not understood until after the war. By the standards of the time, what Hitler said he was doing to the Jews didn't cross any hard moral lines -- to both the German people and most Americans. I actually believe it's the belief in moral absolutes like this that allow monsters to perpetuate atrocities: people assume "well, no rational human would round up all the Jews and murder them" -- which is exactly why it was possible.
      - riversflow 7y ago
        >What else could we have done? We could have engaged with the Japanese in the Pacific and let Europe duke it out and weaken themselves to nothing. Then rolled into Europe with tanks and taken over the whole world? Seriously. I'm not a historian, but I'm pretty sure we could have taken a very different route in WWII. If we really lacked morality, why didn't we just take over the World after WWII, or force the countries we helped out into terrible economic deals like China is doing in Africa. The Marshall plan was charitable.
some_random 7y ago
Ah yeah, US paranoia. It's so European to claim moral supremacy while doing business with a country casually committing genocide.

pnako 7y ago

The rest of the world is doing the exact same thing. Sovereign nations should control their own technical infrastructure and not rely on American, Chinese, Russian or European technology. Open source is certainly a big step in the right direction toward a world where we can better rely on technology. But we're not there yet, when it comes to hardware.

tanilama 7y ago

Yep Truth is, no one can stop any one doing anything. Free market can dissuade your competitors from creating their own supply chain because that won't make economical sense. But once that illusion is gone, the ones that are getting hurt is the current market leaders.

onepointsixC 7y ago

Ah yes, let's do business without concerns of morality. Make western funded technology available CCP SOE's. After all, they gotta power their "exciting" and "innovative"[1] algorithms with some sort of architecture. Less we miss anyone[2]. [1]https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2019/11/12/chinese-firm-sold-cctv-cameras-nhs-advertised-racial-profiling/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2019/11/12/chinese-firm... [2]:https://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2019/sep/23/footage-blindfolded-shackled-prisoners-china-video https://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2019/sep/23/footage-...

wayoutthere 7y ago
Morality is simply "things I like" and "things I don't like". It's not a good basis for policy, especially when moral standards vary significantly between individuals. It's a fool's errand to try to impose your morals on another person as if they were somehow superior (though that arrogance is the foundation of the American psyche). You literally just can't.
- riversflow 7y ago
  There are such things as universal human rights, and China is absolute violating of them. >You literally just can't. Right, which is why we let Hitler exterminate the Jews.
  - wayoutthere 7y ago
    > There are such things as universal human rights, and China is absolute violation of them. You mean the ones that the US routinely violates for "terrorists" and "criminals"? China uses the exact same rhetoric for the people whose rights it violates. The situation with the Uyghurs mirrors a lot of the tactics used in the 70s by American police against black Americans under the guise of the "war on drugs" (hint: our police and prison guards were way more abusive than many people realize). > Right, which is why we let Hitler exterminate the Jews. What else could we have done? Anti-semitism was considered morally acceptable at the time. The American people were completely against the war until Pearl Harbor. Then we locked anyone who looked Japanese or spoke German up in camps. What we were doing was the exact same thing Hitler said he was doing with the Jews. Obviously in hindsight Hitler was awful and the Holocaust was frighteningly real. But the extent of the Holocaust was not understood until after the war. By the standards of the time, what Hitler said he was doing to the Jews didn't cross any hard moral lines -- to both the German people and most Americans. I actually believe it's the belief in moral absolutes like this that allow monsters to perpetuate atrocities: people assume "well, no rational human would round up all the Jews and murder them" -- which is exactly why it was possible.
    - riversflow 7y ago
      >What else could we have done? We could have engaged with the Japanese in the Pacific and let Europe duke it out and weaken themselves to nothing. Then rolled into Europe with tanks and taken over the whole world? Seriously. I'm not a historian, but I'm pretty sure we could have taken a very different route in WWII. If we really lacked morality, why didn't we just take over the World after WWII, or force the countries we helped out into terrible economic deals like China is doing in Africa. The Marshall plan was charitable.

some_random 7y ago

Ah yeah, US paranoia. It's so European to claim moral supremacy while doing business with a country casually committing genocide.