4 ms·

I’ve hand written thousands of sql queries, including a year spent writing nothing but PL/SQL stored procedures. I’d fail your test, not because I’ve never used

I’ve hand written thousands of sql queries, including a year spent writing nothing but PL/SQL stored procedures. I’d fail your test, not because I’ve never used it but because I’ve not had to use it in years and, importantly, I rely on Google to remind me of syntax trivia when moving back to a language I haven’t actively worked in in a while. I HATE trivia questions and I’m convinced they are a sign of a lazy interviewer. If you want to test someone’s knowledge of sql, give them a sample schema, an internet connected computer and five minutes to write an appropriate sql query for your use case.

brightball 7y ago
It’s not a trivia question. It’s directly related to GROUP BY and is a core part of standard SELECT syntax. I’ve never met somebody who has spent any amount of time writing raw SQL who didn’t know it. I’ve met a lot who overly rely on their ORM but “have done a lot of SQL” who don’t.
- dennis_jeeves 7y ago
  Brightball, how many years of coding/sql/developer experience do you have?
  - brightball 7y ago
    Going on 20
    - dennis_jeeves 7y ago
      How much time would you think, the (+)average programmer, say with 10 years experience needs to learn _basic_ sql, along with the HAVING clause, assuming they have never learnt sql during their entire working career? ( we are talking RDBMS concepts from scratch. like Primary keys, normalization etc, and finally sql). (+) average= meaning the programmer should be able to say 'solve' the FizzBuzz under comfortable conditions. Or say add the first n items in an integer array etc...
      - brightball 7y ago
        Largely depends why you ask? I get the impression that most people have taken this to be a pass fail type question in an interview and that’s where the contention is coming from. My interviews are conversations to get to know you, your background, your professional interests, how you think about problems and how closely your resume lines up with those conversations. I like to get people talking about their work to see where their energy level goes. When we start talking through a hypothetical data problem there are people who will describe the problem from the UX perspective, the app code perspective and the database perspective. The question prompts that portion of the conversation.
        dennis_jeeves 7y ago
        >I get the impression that most people have taken this to be a pass fail type question in an interview and that’s where the contention is coming from Precisely. And why not? I have my fellow developers do that ( ask trivia and label the interviewee incompetent, if he cannot answer it) , and most people who have reacted to your post have also probably seen that. Anyway humor me and tell me how much time it would take?
        brightball 7y ago
        Learning the concepts? A few hours Using the concepts in how you naturally think about problems? That will only come from experience. I can't say exactly how much but I'd imagine something in the realm of 6 months minimum of applied usage to different problems.

brightball 7y ago

It’s not a trivia question. It’s directly related to GROUP BY and is a core part of standard SELECT syntax. I’ve never met somebody who has spent any amount of time writing raw SQL who didn’t know it. I’ve met a lot who overly rely on their ORM but “have done a lot of SQL” who don’t.

dennis_jeeves 7y ago
Brightball, how many years of coding/sql/developer experience do you have?
- brightball 7y ago
  Going on 20
  - dennis_jeeves 7y ago
    How much time would you think, the (+)average programmer, say with 10 years experience needs to learn _basic_ sql, along with the HAVING clause, assuming they have never learnt sql during their entire working career? ( we are talking RDBMS concepts from scratch. like Primary keys, normalization etc, and finally sql). (+) average= meaning the programmer should be able to say 'solve' the FizzBuzz under comfortable conditions. Or say add the first n items in an integer array etc...
    - brightball 7y ago
      Largely depends why you ask? I get the impression that most people have taken this to be a pass fail type question in an interview and that’s where the contention is coming from. My interviews are conversations to get to know you, your background, your professional interests, how you think about problems and how closely your resume lines up with those conversations. I like to get people talking about their work to see where their energy level goes. When we start talking through a hypothetical data problem there are people who will describe the problem from the UX perspective, the app code perspective and the database perspective. The question prompts that portion of the conversation.
      - dennis_jeeves 7y ago
        >I get the impression that most people have taken this to be a pass fail type question in an interview and that’s where the contention is coming from Precisely. And why not? I have my fellow developers do that ( ask trivia and label the interviewee incompetent, if he cannot answer it) , and most people who have reacted to your post have also probably seen that. Anyway humor me and tell me how much time it would take?
        brightball 7y ago
        Learning the concepts? A few hours Using the concepts in how you naturally think about problems? That will only come from experience. I can't say exactly how much but I'd imagine something in the realm of 6 months minimum of applied usage to different problems.