5 ms·

Yeah: https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/05/europe/ireland-airbnb-hidden-camera-scli-intl/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/05/europe/ireland-airbnb-hidden-...

yoz-y 7y ago
I am puzzled, why did not they call the police?
- DanBC 7y ago
  Hidden cameras in AirBnBs are horrible. But what crime in Irish law do you think has been broken?
  - CriticalCathed 7y ago
    Reading the article it really appears that this wasn't an attempt at spying on them. So unless there's some kind of wiretapping law in Ireland...
  - dtech 7y ago
    I don't know about Ireland, but in most placed in Europe you can not film people without their knowledge unless it's a public place.
    - DanBC 7y ago
      But is that in criminal or civil law? EDIT: If someone wants to link some laws that's be useful. For the downvoters: I am clearly NOT saying it's okay to hide cameras in an AirBnB. But it's probably not a criminal offence. The police have no power here. I'm NOT saying it's lawful -- the AirBnB owners are probably violating Irish data protection laws. But again those are not enforced by the police. In the UK it's not a criminal offence unless it meets the definition in the sexual offences act 2003, and putting cameras in the living room but not the bedroom probably gives the owners enough deniability to avoid prosecution. https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/42/section/67 https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/42/section/67
      - Sharlin 7y ago
        Criminal, obviously.
        DanBC 7y ago
        No, absolutely not "obviously". It's not a criminal offence in the UK to film people without their knowledge. It breaks data protection law (civil); there are regulations (RIPA) for public authorities but these do not apply to members of the public ; and there is criminal law that covers covert recording if done for sexual gratification, but those may not apply if the cameras have not been placed in toilets or bedrooms. Can you link any of these laws please? Especially for Ireland. I can't find anything for Ireland that would make this a criminal offence. Again, I'm not defending it. I think it's an awful thing to do. But "why didn't they call the police?" is answered by "maybe they did and the police told them it's not a police matter".
        pfg 7y ago
        Germany has a section called "Violation of intimate privacy by taking photographs" that seems to apply here[1]. [1]: https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/englisch_stgb/englisch_stgb.html#p1741 https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/englisch_stgb/englisch_st...
        Sharlin 7y ago
        Okay, not obviously and I should have elaborated. In my country, Finland, watching or recording people without consent, in situations where they have a reasonable expectation of privacy, is a crime punishable by a fine or up to a one-year prison sentence. This includes homes, hotel rooms, changing or fitting rooms, toilets, and similar locations, but also ”upskirt” style photography in public places.
        ascar 7y ago
        Unethical, immoral, obviously. Criminal? Not at all. Starting with different laws in different jurisdictions, over the difference of criminal acts and civil offenses to the point where an AirBnB is your private home and not a hotel ("obviously" you're allowed to film your own home right?). If it's criminal or not is not a matter of simple opinion, but of the laws in that jurisdiction. DanBC doesn't deserve the downvotes.
    - Const-me 7y ago
      In some places in Europe, like here, you can film in public places but robots can't. Security cameras must come with warning signs, and their complete FOV must be private property. Similarly, car video recorders are banned, for the same reason, privacy.
  - DanBC 7y ago
    I struggle to understand why this post has been downvoted and if anyone could explain I would find that useful please.

yoz-y 7y ago

I am puzzled, why did not they call the police?

DanBC 7y ago
Hidden cameras in AirBnBs are horrible. But what crime in Irish law do you think has been broken?
- CriticalCathed 7y ago
  Reading the article it really appears that this wasn't an attempt at spying on them. So unless there's some kind of wiretapping law in Ireland...
- dtech 7y ago
  I don't know about Ireland, but in most placed in Europe you can not film people without their knowledge unless it's a public place.
  - DanBC 7y ago
    But is that in criminal or civil law? EDIT: If someone wants to link some laws that's be useful. For the downvoters: I am clearly NOT saying it's okay to hide cameras in an AirBnB. But it's probably not a criminal offence. The police have no power here. I'm NOT saying it's lawful -- the AirBnB owners are probably violating Irish data protection laws. But again those are not enforced by the police. In the UK it's not a criminal offence unless it meets the definition in the sexual offences act 2003, and putting cameras in the living room but not the bedroom probably gives the owners enough deniability to avoid prosecution. https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/42/section/67 https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/42/section/67
    - Sharlin 7y ago
      Criminal, obviously.
      - DanBC 7y ago
        No, absolutely not "obviously". It's not a criminal offence in the UK to film people without their knowledge. It breaks data protection law (civil); there are regulations (RIPA) for public authorities but these do not apply to members of the public ; and there is criminal law that covers covert recording if done for sexual gratification, but those may not apply if the cameras have not been placed in toilets or bedrooms. Can you link any of these laws please? Especially for Ireland. I can't find anything for Ireland that would make this a criminal offence. Again, I'm not defending it. I think it's an awful thing to do. But "why didn't they call the police?" is answered by "maybe they did and the police told them it's not a police matter".
        pfg 7y ago
        Germany has a section called "Violation of intimate privacy by taking photographs" that seems to apply here[1]. [1]: https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/englisch_stgb/englisch_stgb.html#p1741 https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/englisch_stgb/englisch_st...
        Sharlin 7y ago
        Okay, not obviously and I should have elaborated. In my country, Finland, watching or recording people without consent, in situations where they have a reasonable expectation of privacy, is a crime punishable by a fine or up to a one-year prison sentence. This includes homes, hotel rooms, changing or fitting rooms, toilets, and similar locations, but also ”upskirt” style photography in public places.
      - ascar 7y ago
        Unethical, immoral, obviously. Criminal? Not at all. Starting with different laws in different jurisdictions, over the difference of criminal acts and civil offenses to the point where an AirBnB is your private home and not a hotel ("obviously" you're allowed to film your own home right?). If it's criminal or not is not a matter of simple opinion, but of the laws in that jurisdiction. DanBC doesn't deserve the downvotes.
  - Const-me 7y ago
    In some places in Europe, like here, you can film in public places but robots can't. Security cameras must come with warning signs, and their complete FOV must be private property. Similarly, car video recorders are banned, for the same reason, privacy.
- DanBC 7y ago
  I struggle to understand why this post has been downvoted and if anyone could explain I would find that useful please.