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Well if you care about it so much, contribute either money or code and create ecosystem with the same level of layman UX. It's difficult to get legislation when

Well if you care about it so much, contribute either money or code and create ecosystem with the same level of layman UX. It's difficult to get legislation when you cannot demonstrate alternatives that do not severely reduce convenience. This is a forum of overpaid software engineers. Distributed neural network training isn't science fiction anymore. Go ship or pay others to do so. Brave and DuckDuckGo built entire businesses on the premise of privacy. Many an arrogant reader here HN have no qualms claiming that they can replicate Facebook in a weekend. Go forth and walk the talk. Yet another Mastodon client is cool, but do you know what's cooler? A production quality OCR competitive with Google Cloud Vision API, voice transcription on par with AWS Transcribe, or personal assistants with the ubiquity of Siri.

frereubu 7y ago
I care about it enough to contact my local representative (my MP because I'm in the UK) and he agrees with me that there should be explicit legislation to control the use of these technologies. The EU's GPDR is a step in that direction when it comes to things like automated decision-making. Open source is not a solution here, and to suggest otherwise seems like it misses the wood for the trees. Besides which, I hardly think that restricting the use of cameras on doorbells (which is what this sub-thread is about) is "severely reducing convenience."
- CamperBob2 7y ago
  Don't want a camera on your doorbell? Don't install one. I would like to have the freedom to decide differently.
  - cannonedhamster 7y ago
    Do I have the freedom not to be filmed by your doorbell and have it sent to the police without even your permission to be processed and stored for however long they want and possibly used against me at a later date for something that isn't even a crime now?
    - CamperBob2 7y ago
      Sure. Just stay off my porch.
      - travisporter 7y ago
        And don’t walk by my house? For that matter, don’t bother visiting me?
        CamperBob2 7y ago
        If you're walking by my house, you're in public, and you have no expectation of privacy. (Actually, that's not true -- my house isn't visible from the street, so if you're on my cameras, you're definitely on my property.) If you're visiting me, you're on my property, ditto. Any attempts to "fix" this will only make the world worse in the end. The people you empower to enforce your opinions about privacy in (semi-)public places will begin by exempting themselves from whatever well-intentioned rules you have in mind.
      - dingojohnsons 7y ago
        s/my porch/the public roadway that my camera is recording 24x7/
        CamperBob2 7y ago
        (Shrug) If Google can film public areas, then so can I. See, that's kind of the whole idea behind public areas. You aren't entitled to any expectation of privacy there. That's why they're called public areas, and not private areas. The distinction is remarkably easy to comprehend.
        dingojohnsons 7y ago
        The distinction between could could and should? Or the distinction between private and public? Because all are debated on a regular basis, vary by jurisdiction/country, and are not black and white. Take the issues surrounding filming police officers in public is an example.
jeegsy 7y ago
Rather than working to devise "voice transcription on par with AWS", maybe we can also decide that some things are not necessary and should remain in the scifi realm. The novelty of yelling "Ok google navigate to...." wore off fairly quickly especially when I could just as easily type it. I use the "set an alarm for.." more often though. But really, imagine all the infrastructure required just so people can set alarms and timers with their voices!!!

frereubu 7y ago

I care about it enough to contact my local representative (my MP because I'm in the UK) and he agrees with me that there should be explicit legislation to control the use of these technologies. The EU's GPDR is a step in that direction when it comes to things like automated decision-making. Open source is not a solution here, and to suggest otherwise seems like it misses the wood for the trees. Besides which, I hardly think that restricting the use of cameras on doorbells (which is what this sub-thread is about) is "severely reducing convenience."

CamperBob2 7y ago
Don't want a camera on your doorbell? Don't install one. I would like to have the freedom to decide differently.
- cannonedhamster 7y ago
  Do I have the freedom not to be filmed by your doorbell and have it sent to the police without even your permission to be processed and stored for however long they want and possibly used against me at a later date for something that isn't even a crime now?
  - CamperBob2 7y ago
    Sure. Just stay off my porch.
    - travisporter 7y ago
      And don’t walk by my house? For that matter, don’t bother visiting me?
      - CamperBob2 7y ago
        If you're walking by my house, you're in public, and you have no expectation of privacy. (Actually, that's not true -- my house isn't visible from the street, so if you're on my cameras, you're definitely on my property.) If you're visiting me, you're on my property, ditto. Any attempts to "fix" this will only make the world worse in the end. The people you empower to enforce your opinions about privacy in (semi-)public places will begin by exempting themselves from whatever well-intentioned rules you have in mind.
    - dingojohnsons 7y ago
      s/my porch/the public roadway that my camera is recording 24x7/
      - CamperBob2 7y ago
        (Shrug) If Google can film public areas, then so can I. See, that's kind of the whole idea behind public areas. You aren't entitled to any expectation of privacy there. That's why they're called public areas, and not private areas. The distinction is remarkably easy to comprehend.
        dingojohnsons 7y ago
        The distinction between could could and should? Or the distinction between private and public? Because all are debated on a regular basis, vary by jurisdiction/country, and are not black and white. Take the issues surrounding filming police officers in public is an example.

jeegsy 7y ago

Rather than working to devise "voice transcription on par with AWS", maybe we can also decide that some things are not necessary and should remain in the scifi realm. The novelty of yelling "Ok google navigate to...." wore off fairly quickly especially when I could just as easily type it. I use the "set an alarm for.." more often though. But really, imagine all the infrastructure required just so people can set alarms and timers with their voices!!!