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> Anyway I'm fascinated by all the comments here, none of which discussed the cultural and sociopolitical differences between that of the west and that of China

> Anyway I'm fascinated by all the comments here, none of which discussed the cultural and sociopolitical differences between that of the west and that of China To be fair, you don't describe any particular difference yourself in the following paragraph. You say these cultural differences can't be defined and simultaneously expect us to discuss them.¿ The fact is, there are plenty of businesses who have successfully navigated the cultural and political waters of China-Western relations. Maybe it's not the right time for YC - that's fine. I think we all understand that dealings between the West and China are complicated, to say the least, by cultural, language, and historic differences. That is why we look to the best of us to reach across these differences and make deals so that we can all prosper rather than be left behind as the rest of the world moves on.

archibaldJ 7y ago
It is possible. Just extremely hard. And I will love to write a book about it after I have gone through a good amount of papers on cultural theories and had a good amount of interaction with Chinese of all walks of life so to have a better grasp of "the Chinese way" and somehow utilise the very knowledge of it in my new start-up to make Vsauce-inspired Chinese videos on liberal arts, philosophy, science and tech for Chinese audience (and hopefully go viral) and build a "quality content marketplace" where people in China get to directly connect with local and oversea creatives and they can sponsor these creatives to make explanatory videos on things, etc. The business model would have to follow "the Chinese way" and I'll need to conduct more experiments.
- unityByFreedom 7y ago
  This does not do much to clarify. Which person in Chinese history has had the most influence on your perspective of the "Chinese way"?
  - archibaldJ 7y ago
    That is an interesting question, unfortunately I would say probably no one. "The Chinese way" that I'm talking about here is a contemporary phenomenon that has enabled the Chinese economy to thrive in the last 30 years, which is what makes it more interesting economically speaking than, say, "the Russian way". Basically it is about how the 1.3-billion-people system works and evolves to be more efficient over the years, macro-economically as much as micro-economically. And this is where culture theories come in. Ultimately, it is cultures that govern how people act and think in groups. Cultures towards interpersonal relationships, work-life balance, technology, infrastructure, human right, cynicism, dignity or 面子, how to navigate in grey area, irony and sarcasm, criticism, hierarchy, what roles authority play, how to game the system, etc. Of course, there are also the social-political aspects that arise from it, etc. Recently I stumbled upon a Zhihu post (Zhihu is basically Quora in China) discussing about Vox: "What do you think about the Youtube channel Vox" (https://www.zhihu.com/question/314185948 https://www.zhihu.com/question/314185948) filled with opinions accusing Vox of slandering (抹黑）China in a malevolent (恶意）manner. And the accusations regarding the biasness of Vox were in no way unbiased themselves, commingled with comments on how bad the content quality of all Vox's videos are. If you think this is just pure propaganda or some sort of communist bot commentary then you are taking the simpler path out of this, and people in China would probably find it to be disrespectful. These Chinese comments reflect the general view of people in China who are exposed to Western media that would otherwise be censored without the use of VPN. These people support the government by their hearts and they believe in the government and the surrounding ideologies. There is a somewhat modernist honesty in it. This is why people actually get agitated when the government is being criticised in ways they condemn as "pure slandering". You may be tempted to call out bigotry and label these people as having been brainwashed but from their point of view the same label and description can be applied to people in the West. And epistemologically what is brainwash but just another Freudian invention from the time of bigotry? And what is bigotry really but closed-mindedness? My point is that this is a very complex social-political situation of the 21st century. And some aspects of it certainly have direct impact on consumer behaviours - we have seen that with the boycotting of Dolce & Gabbana. And some aspects of it influence business processes too, and what it means to be professional, and how politics plays or not plays out in a working environment, etc. There are just a lot more to it than what you see on the surface. I have denoted the central mechanism to be cultural but in many ways it is behavioural and psychological as much as linguistic and philosophical. And out of all these the most fascinating is that - let it be a bubble or not - the Chinese economy has been doing extremely well over the past few decades with crazy growth rate and my prediction is that they would continue to do well in the next many decades or so until some sort of a Nash equilibrium is reached. Not only would "the Chinese way" continue to work, it would be more and more relevant in the future, especially to people in the West that will increasingly be affected by it as the world gets ever more interconnected. By understanding more about "the Chinese way", and by having a better appreciation for it, people in both the East and the West would have a much more accurate view of how not just China but the world works. As much as "the Chinese way" is about China it is also about pragmatism and a deviation from Western ideologies.
    - archibaldJ 7y ago
      It just came to me that there was indeed someone in contemporary history that had the most influence on my perspective of "the Chinese way". That would definitely have to be Lee Kuan Yew. Not exactly a Chinese in terms of nationality, but he sure knew profoundly lots about "the Chinese way" in contemporary China. I highly recommend his book One Man's View of the World where there is a chapter if not a couple of them on China.
    - hollerith 7y ago
      >a contemporary phenomenon that has enabled the Chinese economy to thrive in the last 30 years, which is what makes it more interesting economically speaking than, say, "the Russian way". You mean the Russia where per-capita GDP (both nominal and adjusted for purchasing power) is higher than China's?

archibaldJ 7y ago

It is possible. Just extremely hard. And I will love to write a book about it after I have gone through a good amount of papers on cultural theories and had a good amount of interaction with Chinese of all walks of life so to have a better grasp of "the Chinese way" and somehow utilise the very knowledge of it in my new start-up to make Vsauce-inspired Chinese videos on liberal arts, philosophy, science and tech for Chinese audience (and hopefully go viral) and build a "quality content marketplace" where people in China get to directly connect with local and oversea creatives and they can sponsor these creatives to make explanatory videos on things, etc. The business model would have to follow "the Chinese way" and I'll need to conduct more experiments.

unityByFreedom 7y ago
This does not do much to clarify. Which person in Chinese history has had the most influence on your perspective of the "Chinese way"?
- archibaldJ 7y ago
  That is an interesting question, unfortunately I would say probably no one. "The Chinese way" that I'm talking about here is a contemporary phenomenon that has enabled the Chinese economy to thrive in the last 30 years, which is what makes it more interesting economically speaking than, say, "the Russian way". Basically it is about how the 1.3-billion-people system works and evolves to be more efficient over the years, macro-economically as much as micro-economically. And this is where culture theories come in. Ultimately, it is cultures that govern how people act and think in groups. Cultures towards interpersonal relationships, work-life balance, technology, infrastructure, human right, cynicism, dignity or 面子, how to navigate in grey area, irony and sarcasm, criticism, hierarchy, what roles authority play, how to game the system, etc. Of course, there are also the social-political aspects that arise from it, etc. Recently I stumbled upon a Zhihu post (Zhihu is basically Quora in China) discussing about Vox: "What do you think about the Youtube channel Vox" (https://www.zhihu.com/question/314185948 https://www.zhihu.com/question/314185948) filled with opinions accusing Vox of slandering (抹黑）China in a malevolent (恶意）manner. And the accusations regarding the biasness of Vox were in no way unbiased themselves, commingled with comments on how bad the content quality of all Vox's videos are. If you think this is just pure propaganda or some sort of communist bot commentary then you are taking the simpler path out of this, and people in China would probably find it to be disrespectful. These Chinese comments reflect the general view of people in China who are exposed to Western media that would otherwise be censored without the use of VPN. These people support the government by their hearts and they believe in the government and the surrounding ideologies. There is a somewhat modernist honesty in it. This is why people actually get agitated when the government is being criticised in ways they condemn as "pure slandering". You may be tempted to call out bigotry and label these people as having been brainwashed but from their point of view the same label and description can be applied to people in the West. And epistemologically what is brainwash but just another Freudian invention from the time of bigotry? And what is bigotry really but closed-mindedness? My point is that this is a very complex social-political situation of the 21st century. And some aspects of it certainly have direct impact on consumer behaviours - we have seen that with the boycotting of Dolce & Gabbana. And some aspects of it influence business processes too, and what it means to be professional, and how politics plays or not plays out in a working environment, etc. There are just a lot more to it than what you see on the surface. I have denoted the central mechanism to be cultural but in many ways it is behavioural and psychological as much as linguistic and philosophical. And out of all these the most fascinating is that - let it be a bubble or not - the Chinese economy has been doing extremely well over the past few decades with crazy growth rate and my prediction is that they would continue to do well in the next many decades or so until some sort of a Nash equilibrium is reached. Not only would "the Chinese way" continue to work, it would be more and more relevant in the future, especially to people in the West that will increasingly be affected by it as the world gets ever more interconnected. By understanding more about "the Chinese way", and by having a better appreciation for it, people in both the East and the West would have a much more accurate view of how not just China but the world works. As much as "the Chinese way" is about China it is also about pragmatism and a deviation from Western ideologies.
  - archibaldJ 7y ago
    It just came to me that there was indeed someone in contemporary history that had the most influence on my perspective of "the Chinese way". That would definitely have to be Lee Kuan Yew. Not exactly a Chinese in terms of nationality, but he sure knew profoundly lots about "the Chinese way" in contemporary China. I highly recommend his book One Man's View of the World where there is a chapter if not a couple of them on China.
  - hollerith 7y ago
    >a contemporary phenomenon that has enabled the Chinese economy to thrive in the last 30 years, which is what makes it more interesting economically speaking than, say, "the Russian way". You mean the Russia where per-capita GDP (both nominal and adjusted for purchasing power) is higher than China's?