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What is the alternative to Apple? I don't see Linux being solid in a few years time (or ever really). I say this after trying Linux again every year in the hop

What is the alternative to Apple? I don't see Linux being solid in a few years time (or ever really). I say this after trying Linux again every year in the hopes that this is the year it is solid. My anecdotal experience for this year is that the latest Ubuntu release had a problem where after performing a clean install and rebooting, the login screen will not allow me to enter the desktop. Turns out the desktop was crashing in the background because of a Nvidia driver. If they cannot even QA the login procedure with the default software then I don't have long term confidence. I will definitely try again in 2020 in the hopes that I am wrong. Windows is degrading as they add more cruft to the OS while ignoring fundamental flaws that have persisted for years. Basic things such as smooth mouse movement and dual monitor scaling still do not work correctly. Meanwhile I am bombarded with more and more cruft that steals focus from whatever I am doing.

frenchyatwork 7y ago
Did you by a computer that came with Ubuntu? IIRC, Dell and a few smaller vendors sell these. I would imagine you could get some support from the computer vendor if the video card driver was that broken.
zeroc8 7y ago
It's not that hard to find out which Hardware works well with Linux and which doesn't. I'm running Ubuntu 1804 on a Dell 7740 as well as on a Thinkpad 450 without any problems whatsoever. And if I was based in the US, I'd probably go with System76 or some other Linux specialist.
magduf 7y ago
Using Nvidia with Linux is like buying an Apple phone and expecting to be able to do whatever you want with it. Linux has been "solid" for decades now. Just don't use Nvidia. Some people use it and it works just fine, others don't. But people using Intel or Radeon video just don't have these issues.
slavik81 7y ago
You'll have significantly fewer problems with Intel graphics. The Linux drivers are all open-source and they're better integrated with the rest of the system. The only question is if Intel hardware is sufficient for your workload. NVIDIA makes great hardware, but the interface to it is complex and poorly documented. It's bad enough that Linus once stated that "NVIDIA has been the single worst company we have ever dealt with."
- Answerawake 7y ago
  You and all the other replies are missing the whole point. The computer is a tool to get work done. I just want a computer that allows me to get my work done in the least amount of pain as possible. I don't see how Apple gets dethroned in a few years time if this is the state of the competitors. This computer in its current configuration worked fine with last year's Ubuntu distro. Next year I suspect this will be fixed but something else will be broken. I could switch to Intel but I still won't avoid the next random issue. At the end of the day, the time and money spent will be greater on Linux and for what? So I can say I'm running a complete open system?
  - lol768 7y ago
    > You and all the other replies are missing the whole point. The computer is a tool to get work done. I just want a computer that allows me to get my work done in the least amount of pain as possible. I don't see how Apple gets dethroned in a few years time if this is the state of the competitors. With respect, macOS "allows you to get your work done in the least amount of pain as possible" precisely because you are used to it and its relative quirks. I have to use a Mac to occasionally maintain an iOS app. Here's my anecdotal experience: the keyboard shortcuts are entirely unintuitive, Xcode and the Apple store are downright painful to use (Apple's store literally doesn't accept screenshots generated by its own simulator). Software shipped on the machine is often outdated or just broken (trying to install .NET Core on a Mac and dealing with the ancient version of OpenSSL was not fun) and installing new software is a poor experience compared to using apt-get or yum. I remember using Xcode and being prompted for some credentials during the publishing process - except it prompted more than once. And it was never clear whether I was getting the password right, or I'd typed it in wrong. It turns out windows shake horizontally when you get the password wrong, and if the window disappears and immediately re-appears again then you've got the password correct but you need to type it in again. Recently I updated Xcode's build component and it decided to silently stop paying any notice to the CODE_SIGNING_REQUIRED environment variable. Safari is just as poorly designed. Apple frequently enjoy "doing their own thing" which defies conventions set by every other platform - tab behaviour is broken out of the box and does not cycle through links. <iframe> heights are ignored. On mobile, simple CSS properties such as background-attachment aren't supported. Whenever I have to use a Mac I try to open a terminal as soon as I can and do all work inside one away from Finder and all the other GUI apps, because that's at least a relatively sane part of the system - but I couldn't ever get serious work done on one. My point is that your anecdotal experiences are far from universal.
smabie 7y ago
Maybe you should stop thinking Ubuntu is Linux and actually try different window managers. I’m of the opinion that Ubuntu sucks, but that doesn’t really impeach the stability of Linux. Though, if you want to get into it, Linux does actually suck. Really the only thing good about it is the software/hardware compatibility and the performance. OpenBSD is such a nicer system, it’s not even funny. Unfortunately, most users won’t find it practical as a non-server OS.

frenchyatwork 7y ago

Did you by a computer that came with Ubuntu? IIRC, Dell and a few smaller vendors sell these. I would imagine you could get some support from the computer vendor if the video card driver was that broken.

zeroc8 7y ago

It's not that hard to find out which Hardware works well with Linux and which doesn't. I'm running Ubuntu 1804 on a Dell 7740 as well as on a Thinkpad 450 without any problems whatsoever. And if I was based in the US, I'd probably go with System76 or some other Linux specialist.

magduf 7y ago

Using Nvidia with Linux is like buying an Apple phone and expecting to be able to do whatever you want with it. Linux has been "solid" for decades now. Just don't use Nvidia. Some people use it and it works just fine, others don't. But people using Intel or Radeon video just don't have these issues.

slavik81 7y ago

You'll have significantly fewer problems with Intel graphics. The Linux drivers are all open-source and they're better integrated with the rest of the system. The only question is if Intel hardware is sufficient for your workload. NVIDIA makes great hardware, but the interface to it is complex and poorly documented. It's bad enough that Linus once stated that "NVIDIA has been the single worst company we have ever dealt with."

Answerawake 7y ago
You and all the other replies are missing the whole point. The computer is a tool to get work done. I just want a computer that allows me to get my work done in the least amount of pain as possible. I don't see how Apple gets dethroned in a few years time if this is the state of the competitors. This computer in its current configuration worked fine with last year's Ubuntu distro. Next year I suspect this will be fixed but something else will be broken. I could switch to Intel but I still won't avoid the next random issue. At the end of the day, the time and money spent will be greater on Linux and for what? So I can say I'm running a complete open system?
- lol768 7y ago
  > You and all the other replies are missing the whole point. The computer is a tool to get work done. I just want a computer that allows me to get my work done in the least amount of pain as possible. I don't see how Apple gets dethroned in a few years time if this is the state of the competitors. With respect, macOS "allows you to get your work done in the least amount of pain as possible" precisely because you are used to it and its relative quirks. I have to use a Mac to occasionally maintain an iOS app. Here's my anecdotal experience: the keyboard shortcuts are entirely unintuitive, Xcode and the Apple store are downright painful to use (Apple's store literally doesn't accept screenshots generated by its own simulator). Software shipped on the machine is often outdated or just broken (trying to install .NET Core on a Mac and dealing with the ancient version of OpenSSL was not fun) and installing new software is a poor experience compared to using apt-get or yum. I remember using Xcode and being prompted for some credentials during the publishing process - except it prompted more than once. And it was never clear whether I was getting the password right, or I'd typed it in wrong. It turns out windows shake horizontally when you get the password wrong, and if the window disappears and immediately re-appears again then you've got the password correct but you need to type it in again. Recently I updated Xcode's build component and it decided to silently stop paying any notice to the CODE_SIGNING_REQUIRED environment variable. Safari is just as poorly designed. Apple frequently enjoy "doing their own thing" which defies conventions set by every other platform - tab behaviour is broken out of the box and does not cycle through links. <iframe> heights are ignored. On mobile, simple CSS properties such as background-attachment aren't supported. Whenever I have to use a Mac I try to open a terminal as soon as I can and do all work inside one away from Finder and all the other GUI apps, because that's at least a relatively sane part of the system - but I couldn't ever get serious work done on one. My point is that your anecdotal experiences are far from universal.

smabie 7y ago

Maybe you should stop thinking Ubuntu is Linux and actually try different window managers. I’m of the opinion that Ubuntu sucks, but that doesn’t really impeach the stability of Linux. Though, if you want to get into it, Linux does actually suck. Really the only thing good about it is the software/hardware compatibility and the performance. OpenBSD is such a nicer system, it’s not even funny. Unfortunately, most users won’t find it practical as a non-server OS.