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There are many calls for personal responsibility here. But I think the average person is not making a choice to sustain permanent hearing damage – most people d

There are many calls for personal responsibility here. But I think the average person is not making a choice to sustain permanent hearing damage – most people don't know the risks. I used to own a decible meter. I brought it to a movie theater (large chain) and found sustained volume of 100+ decibels. It was physically painful. I was the only customer who complained to the theater. I asked what sound level they intended to set the movie to. They told me it's up to the projectionist, who sets the volume knob in the booth based on no measurement or preset. There's a lot of real harm being done, and I would like to see at the very least some basic informative disclosure. And operators should be held responsible for creating dangerous conditions that are not disclosed or agreed to by customers. If people want to sustain hearing damage for a night of enjoyment, they should do so only willingly (and therefore knowingly). I'm very keen to protect my own hearing, so I carry musician's earplugs (reduces volume without sounding muffled) and wear them often – not just at obviously loud places like concerts, but in common situations like loud restaurants.

goda90 7y ago
Do you know how these musician's earplugs work? I imagine instead of just blocking vibrating air like regular earplugs, it must be trying to dissipate the sound waves a bit. Is that even possible across the whole range of sound?
- apk-d 7y ago
  Materials absorb different parts of the frequency spectrum with varying efficiency. Regular earplugs are made to simply stop as much sound as possible and hence there's a lot of muffle at the top of the spectrum (that's easiest to achieve - cover your ears!). Concert earplugs are more carefully designed to absorb the entire spectrum as uniformly as possible.
RonanTheGrey 7y ago
It's been my experience that most places can reduce volume levels (music, theaters etc) about 10-15% without loss of experience or fidelity and I have taken to actually asking managers to turn down volume because my ears actually hurt. It's loud for the sake of loud. I can't understand why the music in a restaurant needs to be so loud that I have to scream at the people at my table to be heard. Obviously we're screaming over other tables, too, who are also screaming over us. It's a big scream fest, and I have observed that alot of it starts with high music volume levels. Turn down the damn music, come on. Oh and get off my lawn. (I'm not that old really hah but I sound that way when I make an issue of this...)
- goda90 7y ago
  I've gone to two rock concerts that the volume was so loud that is was distorting the music. Of course my ears hurt, so I took to covering them a bit. My friend often goes to concerts and wasn't phased at all. I imagine the people in charge of sound have already lost some hearing, and they don't care if it sounds great or not.
  - apk-d 7y ago
    I've had this exact problem attending most concerts (only classical music seems mostly fine). The music sounds very distorted (like a damaged speaker or an audio recording with heavy clipping) and after a while it gets physically painful to listen. Movies are sometimes uncomfortable, but the volume level is less constant which helps a lot. I've asked around and nobody seems to share this experience. I didn't use to go to live events often and it actually took me years to realize that my hearing's at fault.
    - waterhouse 7y ago
      A similar data point: I carry earplugs everywhere, and usually wear them when I'm at the movie theater (which is kind of rare) and at parties where there's loud music or talking; I do this because sooner or later I notice my ears hurting from the noise. The earplugs I have are flesh-colored ("Hearos"), and I don't think most people notice them unless I point them out. I'm not sure whether I'm an outlier in terms of hearing sensitivity, or if it's just that I somehow wired myself to interpret certain stimuli as pain, or what. I also find bright sunlight and spicy food painful, and when I've gotten massages, usually I prefer a much lighter touch than what appears to be normal. I guess smell is the remaining sense; I guess I have evidence that (some) smells bother me more than they bother others.
  - radus 7y ago
    Depending on the particular band it's possible that they use distortion as part of their sound..
  - pas 7y ago
    Use party earplugs, even the low grade ~20 bucks version is night-and-day. Some concerts/parties/clubs are definitely purposely too loud. Yes, many people going are already hearing-compromised.
robertlf 7y ago
I haven't attended a movie theater for the last five years for this very reason. I don't think the average person has a clue as to the damage being inflicted on their ears when they go to the movies and I believe the number of tinnitus cases in the U.S. will skyrocket in the years ahead, not only from going to the movies but from all the other "noise pollution" we're subject to on a daily basis.
- Muuuchem 7y ago
  Ahhh I think my main problem is turning my headphones up to hear podcasts over the train/BART!
eisa01 7y ago
Agree Awareness may hopefully be raised now that the Apple Watch measures sound exposure
- ReverseCold 7y ago
  and with Apple/Beats branded headphones it accurately measures exposure through those as well I wish there was a way to give it data for other headphones too, since I don't use Apple earbuds
Wyth 7y ago
I've been an audio/visual engineer and freelance projectionist for many years, and would like to touch on a couple things. The level of volume should be equalised to 80-83 decibels from each audio channel at a level of '7' on the sound processor. So, in theory, it should not be 'up to the projectionist'. There are, however, a couple problems. Most movie theatres do not have projectionists anymore. The movies you are watching on screen are being played by a manager on the other side of the building, that never once checks on it. At all. Frankly, it's irresponsible to not ever check inside of the theatre to make sure the picture and sound are ok. In fact, I've worked in many theatres where the manager doesn't even know where the projection booth is, or how to get there. If there's a problem, they only know about it when there's a complaint, and even then it's easier to just give out comp tickets to the people who complained, while they continue making money off the people who don't. Usually, they'll even continue running shows in that room before calling someone in to fix the problem. The other issue, is that studios, in an attempt to keep up with the audio level of pre-show advertisements, continue mixing their films even louder, disregarding a standard that is supposed to be set, to keep people's hearing safe. Which in turn has the theatre chain turn the volume up on their ads even further. Most of this is from neglect from theatre managers and higher ups, not projectionists who randomly decide to blow people's hearing.
hartator 7y ago
Completely agree. I've been in situations several times where the sound was awfully loud for no reasons. Obvious concert and clubs but also less suspicious theaters, outside movie events, and indeed restaurants. Now when in loud environments, my left ear is buzzing and perceived the sounds as distorted. When it's not. Similar to a cranked up bad speaker like other commenters pointed in it out. It's very hard to describe to people as it's not very common.
- laputan_machine 7y ago
  I have the exact same thing in my right ear. I assume it's permanently damaged, but I've never had my hearing checked.
brettnak 7y ago
The movie theater one is actually kind of interesting. There is a certain maximum audio power that a room can sustain before loosing fidelity. I think _all_ sound engineers know about this, but a projectionist with a volume knob probably does not. Next time you're in a place where the audio is too loud for you to hear, try to listen carefully for a few seconds. You might discover that despite being too loud, it actually sounds bad, and reducing the volume would actually _improve_ the audio fidelity.
RickJWagner 7y ago
Your words of warning are warranted. I once ran a large stump grinder without hearing protection. A huge mistake. I now have spotty hearing, especially in crowded rooms, and it is a huge disadvantage. Protect your hearing! Easy to do, so worth the effort.
mbrameld 7y ago
I served in the Air Force and did a 9 month tour in Afghanistan preceded by 3 months of combat skills training. We were issued ear plugs and used them religiously. Turns out they were defective and now I have permanent hearing loss in my right ear and tinnitus in both ears. https://www.militarytimes.com/news/your-military/2019/02/14/hundreds-of-vets-are-suing-over-these-defective-combat-earplugs/ https://www.militarytimes.com/news/your-military/2019/02/14/...
- Fjolsvith 7y ago
  There was a radio advertisement about a class action settlement over those ear plugs. You should look it up.

goda90 7y ago

Do you know how these musician's earplugs work? I imagine instead of just blocking vibrating air like regular earplugs, it must be trying to dissipate the sound waves a bit. Is that even possible across the whole range of sound?

apk-d 7y ago
Materials absorb different parts of the frequency spectrum with varying efficiency. Regular earplugs are made to simply stop as much sound as possible and hence there's a lot of muffle at the top of the spectrum (that's easiest to achieve - cover your ears!). Concert earplugs are more carefully designed to absorb the entire spectrum as uniformly as possible.

RonanTheGrey 7y ago

It's been my experience that most places can reduce volume levels (music, theaters etc) about 10-15% without loss of experience or fidelity and I have taken to actually asking managers to turn down volume because my ears actually hurt. It's loud for the sake of loud. I can't understand why the music in a restaurant needs to be so loud that I have to scream at the people at my table to be heard. Obviously we're screaming over other tables, too, who are also screaming over us. It's a big scream fest, and I have observed that alot of it starts with high music volume levels. Turn down the damn music, come on. Oh and get off my lawn. (I'm not that old really hah but I sound that way when I make an issue of this...)

goda90 7y ago
I've gone to two rock concerts that the volume was so loud that is was distorting the music. Of course my ears hurt, so I took to covering them a bit. My friend often goes to concerts and wasn't phased at all. I imagine the people in charge of sound have already lost some hearing, and they don't care if it sounds great or not.
- apk-d 7y ago
  I've had this exact problem attending most concerts (only classical music seems mostly fine). The music sounds very distorted (like a damaged speaker or an audio recording with heavy clipping) and after a while it gets physically painful to listen. Movies are sometimes uncomfortable, but the volume level is less constant which helps a lot. I've asked around and nobody seems to share this experience. I didn't use to go to live events often and it actually took me years to realize that my hearing's at fault.
  - waterhouse 7y ago
    A similar data point: I carry earplugs everywhere, and usually wear them when I'm at the movie theater (which is kind of rare) and at parties where there's loud music or talking; I do this because sooner or later I notice my ears hurting from the noise. The earplugs I have are flesh-colored ("Hearos"), and I don't think most people notice them unless I point them out. I'm not sure whether I'm an outlier in terms of hearing sensitivity, or if it's just that I somehow wired myself to interpret certain stimuli as pain, or what. I also find bright sunlight and spicy food painful, and when I've gotten massages, usually I prefer a much lighter touch than what appears to be normal. I guess smell is the remaining sense; I guess I have evidence that (some) smells bother me more than they bother others.
- radus 7y ago
  Depending on the particular band it's possible that they use distortion as part of their sound..
- pas 7y ago
  Use party earplugs, even the low grade ~20 bucks version is night-and-day. Some concerts/parties/clubs are definitely purposely too loud. Yes, many people going are already hearing-compromised.

robertlf 7y ago

I haven't attended a movie theater for the last five years for this very reason. I don't think the average person has a clue as to the damage being inflicted on their ears when they go to the movies and I believe the number of tinnitus cases in the U.S. will skyrocket in the years ahead, not only from going to the movies but from all the other "noise pollution" we're subject to on a daily basis.

Muuuchem 7y ago
Ahhh I think my main problem is turning my headphones up to hear podcasts over the train/BART!

eisa01 7y ago

Agree Awareness may hopefully be raised now that the Apple Watch measures sound exposure

ReverseCold 7y ago
and with Apple/Beats branded headphones it accurately measures exposure through those as well I wish there was a way to give it data for other headphones too, since I don't use Apple earbuds

Wyth 7y ago

I've been an audio/visual engineer and freelance projectionist for many years, and would like to touch on a couple things. The level of volume should be equalised to 80-83 decibels from each audio channel at a level of '7' on the sound processor. So, in theory, it should not be 'up to the projectionist'. There are, however, a couple problems. Most movie theatres do not have projectionists anymore. The movies you are watching on screen are being played by a manager on the other side of the building, that never once checks on it. At all. Frankly, it's irresponsible to not ever check inside of the theatre to make sure the picture and sound are ok. In fact, I've worked in many theatres where the manager doesn't even know where the projection booth is, or how to get there. If there's a problem, they only know about it when there's a complaint, and even then it's easier to just give out comp tickets to the people who complained, while they continue making money off the people who don't. Usually, they'll even continue running shows in that room before calling someone in to fix the problem. The other issue, is that studios, in an attempt to keep up with the audio level of pre-show advertisements, continue mixing their films even louder, disregarding a standard that is supposed to be set, to keep people's hearing safe. Which in turn has the theatre chain turn the volume up on their ads even further. Most of this is from neglect from theatre managers and higher ups, not projectionists who randomly decide to blow people's hearing.

hartator 7y ago

Completely agree. I've been in situations several times where the sound was awfully loud for no reasons. Obvious concert and clubs but also less suspicious theaters, outside movie events, and indeed restaurants. Now when in loud environments, my left ear is buzzing and perceived the sounds as distorted. When it's not. Similar to a cranked up bad speaker like other commenters pointed in it out. It's very hard to describe to people as it's not very common.

laputan_machine 7y ago
I have the exact same thing in my right ear. I assume it's permanently damaged, but I've never had my hearing checked.

brettnak 7y ago

The movie theater one is actually kind of interesting. There is a certain maximum audio power that a room can sustain before loosing fidelity. I think _all_ sound engineers know about this, but a projectionist with a volume knob probably does not. Next time you're in a place where the audio is too loud for you to hear, try to listen carefully for a few seconds. You might discover that despite being too loud, it actually sounds bad, and reducing the volume would actually _improve_ the audio fidelity.

RickJWagner 7y ago

Your words of warning are warranted. I once ran a large stump grinder without hearing protection. A huge mistake. I now have spotty hearing, especially in crowded rooms, and it is a huge disadvantage. Protect your hearing! Easy to do, so worth the effort.

mbrameld 7y ago

I served in the Air Force and did a 9 month tour in Afghanistan preceded by 3 months of combat skills training. We were issued ear plugs and used them religiously. Turns out they were defective and now I have permanent hearing loss in my right ear and tinnitus in both ears. https://www.militarytimes.com/news/your-military/2019/02/14/hundreds-of-vets-are-suing-over-these-defective-combat-earplugs/ https://www.militarytimes.com/news/your-military/2019/02/14/...

Fjolsvith 7y ago
There was a radio advertisement about a class action settlement over those ear plugs. You should look it up.