6 ms·

Spot on, the best cure for burnout isn't a cure at all, it's prevention.

by intarga 7y ago

HNLurker2 7y ago
But preventative means limit my potential
- parasight 7y ago
  I think this touches the root cause.
- dt5702 7y ago
  Only in the short term. Long term your productivity would be better as you wouldn’t be suffering from health problems.
  - close04 7y ago
    I think the point is that you don't know the limit until you reach it and when you do it may be too late. Seeing a spike in stress doesn't necessarily mean you'll burn out or that it will last forever so many try to weather it out with unfortunate consequences. But I guess YMMV, every person is different. Some can take more punishment and get more time to decide if they want to keep it up. Some may burn out faster than they can realize.
  - normalnorm 7y ago
    That is fucked up. We are human beings, not some machine to be measured by how productive we are.
    - rusk 7y ago
      I think you are missing the point. You can be productive for yourselfas wellas for other people ...
- onion2k 7y ago
  Burnout will limit your potential a lot more.
- madaxe_again 7y ago
  Your potential to do what? Trade happiness for money? Because that’s how this works. We’re totally sold on the idea that more money means a better life. More. More. Always more. Always wanting. Always lacking. Happiness isn’t in more. It’s in everything. You just have to have the time to find it - and time is the crux. You only live once; time is your most precious and finite commodity. Each day that passes is irrevocably gone - and as morbid as it may be, you don’t know which will be your last. I have had friends drop dead in their 20s and 30s both out of the blue, and after agonising illnesses. If your work makes you happy, great. If your work is gently or not so gently killing you, and you are persevering for some abstract goal of “more”, you are taking a dangerous wager - your precious time against the chance of making it into the 0.0001% - the idea being that if you win, then you won’t have to work. That’s fundamentally the bet we take when we venture into a career. There’s a shortcut. Don’t work any more than you absolutely have to to keep the lights on. I left my business a few years ago after a decade, withered and broken, mentally and physically damaged. I do as little contracting as I can get away with to cover my living expenses, which I’ve dramatically cut by moving off grid in a cheap country. I have so much time to read, to work on projects and hobbies, to just stand and stare at the river running by. I used to stand in the shower, weeping, and think about how I would kill myself. Now I weep only with happiness. Life doesn’t have to be a slog.
  - 1996 7y ago
    No prospect, no future. You seem to be waiting for death.
    - madaxe_again 7y ago
      No, I’m living life. If you measure your entire worth through your position in a corporate hierarchy, sure, no future. Life isn’t about how much stuff you have, but that’s for you to find out - most only discover this just before they die, if ever.
      - 1996 7y ago
        I have little care for such things. Human interaction is different - as is doing things with other human beings. Hobby, work, paid, volunteer - doesn't matter. You seem to be living a recluse life. I find that concerning
- coretx 7y ago
  If you think that to invest more time in planning & rest will limit your potential, you're likely to be wrong. A proper life balance tends to support you achieving your full potential. The balancing act has a positive return on investment.
- oneepic 7y ago
  This might just mean that the work involved in "reaching your potential" literally wouldn't make you happy. I think you know that moving further would really suck in some way. So either let it go and do something else you're happy with, or work around this by figuring out what makes you happy/unhappy about this particular thing and work on refining your mindset around it. Eventually you'll decide whether or not it's a good idea to keep going in that direction. You'll also get a clearer idea of what you actually want to do, and get rid of those weird "strong morals" that people tend to have, that really do limit their options (for example, "I'll never be able to leave this job" or when addicts feel there's no way out and they're too scared to quit, even though everything about their situation objectively sucks). (i am only an armchair therapist, not a real one)
- bregma 7y ago
  A young bull and an old bull stood atop a hill grazing some sweet sweet grass. By and by they spotted a herd of cows let into the pasture in the valley below them. The young bull pawed the ground with his hoof, snorted, and bellowed "let's run down the hill and service us one of those there cows!!!" The old bull continued to chew his cud thoughtfully. After a pause, he said "Nope. Let's walk down the hill and service them all."
lnsru 7y ago
Funny thing is that before reaching final stage the body sends signs. Lots of them and often. Most of knowledge workers heard this word “burnout” and it’s nothing new. Burnout does not happen over night, it takes months and even years. Close people also see the changes, but the subject goes forward ignoring everything. Why is so difficult to slow down? Is it better to spend couple years recovering instead of leaving harmful environment immediately?
- rusk 7y ago
  There is this cultural myth of the “hero worker” who puts everything on the line to succeed. I think some people identify with this more than others and basically set themselves up with an abusive external locus of evaluation.
turk73 7y ago
I have much to say about this subject because I've been working in software development for about 17 years. I'll try not to bore you. I've had several times where I had panic attacks and didn't realize what was wrong until later on. I never took many sick days, just had to up and quit a couple of jobs with little or no notice. So far, GERD has been the one long term health issues I have from it. I took Omeprazole for years and then recently we all found out that it's carcinogenic. That's great! I quit taking it daily about a year ago, but still need it sometimes. The damage is done. You can't un-ring a bell. I spend a lot more of my free time on fitness now, but it's not a cure all. Pacing yourself is a great concept, however, management pushes harder and harder and they don't see you as a person, they see you as a replaceable piece of meat. Developers today lack a solid seat at the corporate table and the situation has only gotten worse in recent years due to the importation of so many H1Bs who are desperate to earn money and stay in the US. The importation of people who can't/won't push back or ever say no puts everyone at health and financial risk. Here is a ground-level view of corporatism in all its Satanic glory. If corporations do end up ruling us, once again becoming able to project violence, regular people are in for a very hard time.

Spot on, the best cure for burnout isn't a cure at all, it's prevention.

HNLurker2 7y ago

But preventative means limit my potential

parasight 7y ago
I think this touches the root cause.
dt5702 7y ago
Only in the short term. Long term your productivity would be better as you wouldn’t be suffering from health problems.
- close04 7y ago
  I think the point is that you don't know the limit until you reach it and when you do it may be too late. Seeing a spike in stress doesn't necessarily mean you'll burn out or that it will last forever so many try to weather it out with unfortunate consequences. But I guess YMMV, every person is different. Some can take more punishment and get more time to decide if they want to keep it up. Some may burn out faster than they can realize.
- normalnorm 7y ago
  That is fucked up. We are human beings, not some machine to be measured by how productive we are.
  - rusk 7y ago
    I think you are missing the point. You can be productive for yourselfas wellas for other people ...
onion2k 7y ago
Burnout will limit your potential a lot more.
madaxe_again 7y ago
Your potential to do what? Trade happiness for money? Because that’s how this works. We’re totally sold on the idea that more money means a better life. More. More. Always more. Always wanting. Always lacking. Happiness isn’t in more. It’s in everything. You just have to have the time to find it - and time is the crux. You only live once; time is your most precious and finite commodity. Each day that passes is irrevocably gone - and as morbid as it may be, you don’t know which will be your last. I have had friends drop dead in their 20s and 30s both out of the blue, and after agonising illnesses. If your work makes you happy, great. If your work is gently or not so gently killing you, and you are persevering for some abstract goal of “more”, you are taking a dangerous wager - your precious time against the chance of making it into the 0.0001% - the idea being that if you win, then you won’t have to work. That’s fundamentally the bet we take when we venture into a career. There’s a shortcut. Don’t work any more than you absolutely have to to keep the lights on. I left my business a few years ago after a decade, withered and broken, mentally and physically damaged. I do as little contracting as I can get away with to cover my living expenses, which I’ve dramatically cut by moving off grid in a cheap country. I have so much time to read, to work on projects and hobbies, to just stand and stare at the river running by. I used to stand in the shower, weeping, and think about how I would kill myself. Now I weep only with happiness. Life doesn’t have to be a slog.
- 1996 7y ago
  No prospect, no future. You seem to be waiting for death.
  - madaxe_again 7y ago
    No, I’m living life. If you measure your entire worth through your position in a corporate hierarchy, sure, no future. Life isn’t about how much stuff you have, but that’s for you to find out - most only discover this just before they die, if ever.
    - 1996 7y ago
      I have little care for such things. Human interaction is different - as is doing things with other human beings. Hobby, work, paid, volunteer - doesn't matter. You seem to be living a recluse life. I find that concerning
coretx 7y ago
If you think that to invest more time in planning & rest will limit your potential, you're likely to be wrong. A proper life balance tends to support you achieving your full potential. The balancing act has a positive return on investment.
oneepic 7y ago
This might just mean that the work involved in "reaching your potential" literally wouldn't make you happy. I think you know that moving further would really suck in some way. So either let it go and do something else you're happy with, or work around this by figuring out what makes you happy/unhappy about this particular thing and work on refining your mindset around it. Eventually you'll decide whether or not it's a good idea to keep going in that direction. You'll also get a clearer idea of what you actually want to do, and get rid of those weird "strong morals" that people tend to have, that really do limit their options (for example, "I'll never be able to leave this job" or when addicts feel there's no way out and they're too scared to quit, even though everything about their situation objectively sucks). (i am only an armchair therapist, not a real one)
bregma 7y ago
A young bull and an old bull stood atop a hill grazing some sweet sweet grass. By and by they spotted a herd of cows let into the pasture in the valley below them. The young bull pawed the ground with his hoof, snorted, and bellowed "let's run down the hill and service us one of those there cows!!!" The old bull continued to chew his cud thoughtfully. After a pause, he said "Nope. Let's walk down the hill and service them all."

lnsru 7y ago

Funny thing is that before reaching final stage the body sends signs. Lots of them and often. Most of knowledge workers heard this word “burnout” and it’s nothing new. Burnout does not happen over night, it takes months and even years. Close people also see the changes, but the subject goes forward ignoring everything. Why is so difficult to slow down? Is it better to spend couple years recovering instead of leaving harmful environment immediately?

rusk 7y ago
There is this cultural myth of the “hero worker” who puts everything on the line to succeed. I think some people identify with this more than others and basically set themselves up with an abusive external locus of evaluation.

turk73 7y ago

I have much to say about this subject because I've been working in software development for about 17 years. I'll try not to bore you. I've had several times where I had panic attacks and didn't realize what was wrong until later on. I never took many sick days, just had to up and quit a couple of jobs with little or no notice. So far, GERD has been the one long term health issues I have from it. I took Omeprazole for years and then recently we all found out that it's carcinogenic. That's great! I quit taking it daily about a year ago, but still need it sometimes. The damage is done. You can't un-ring a bell. I spend a lot more of my free time on fitness now, but it's not a cure all. Pacing yourself is a great concept, however, management pushes harder and harder and they don't see you as a person, they see you as a replaceable piece of meat. Developers today lack a solid seat at the corporate table and the situation has only gotten worse in recent years due to the importation of so many H1Bs who are desperate to earn money and stay in the US. The importation of people who can't/won't push back or ever say no puts everyone at health and financial risk. Here is a ground-level view of corporatism in all its Satanic glory. If corporations do end up ruling us, once again becoming able to project violence, regular people are in for a very hard time.