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Ah, you've made a snap judgement there. See, you have one incident - it's a bad one, sure, but definitely not representative of the channel. And, as it is, I a

by ErrantX 16y ago

Ah, you've made a snap judgement there. See, you have one incident - it's a bad one, sure, but definitely not representative of the channel. And, as it is, I accept their explanation for it (which appears to be; they were airing a sermon from a slightly more hard line cleric, and he made extreme comments. Turning that into not having moral problems accepting... etc. is something of a leap. And I don't think you could prove/show this is systemic problem at the channel. (We occasionally have racist/nasty comments made on UK media, and lots of fuss about it, that doesn't make the channel racist!) You should always generally distrust your media source as a matter of course. I'm not going to argue this with you because it looks like you have an axe to grind, and this really isn't the place. But put AJ next to a lot of US media and I find them more neutral and informative :) Anti-Semitism is a huge problem in a wide portion of media (as I mentioned), it is one of the problems that means we have to take what they say with caution in some matters, but from my observation (and barring a few slips) AJ has a better track record than, says, FOX. > I should also note that you lack references for your claim? In case it is not obvious... this is my opinion... sheesh. :)

berntb 16y ago
>>you have one incident ... And, as it is, I accept their explanation for it First, do you have a reference to that claim, then? Second, it took me five seconds to find this: "Former Inmate: Guantanamo Jews Used Witchcraft on Prisoners, Made Me Feel a Cat Was Trying to Penetrate Me" http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/0/0/0/0/0/64/2730.htm http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/0/0/0/0/0/64/2730.htm That was a second incident. Or is that just normal Al Jazeera news -- which you claim is one of the best...? Or was that also sent directly without the standard five seconds safety to be able to cut off? :-) Edit: It is problematic with tv, since you can't just check the original language versions by translate.google.com. It do seem to be easy to find lots of weird stuff covered by non-English Al J. Which I think I'll base an opinion on. I'll just note the general lack of references for the claims of credibility.
- ErrantX 16y ago
  Ahem, If we are talking about bias then MEMRI is possibly the worst source you could have used :) > I'll just note the general lack of references for the claims of credibility. This is unfair, and bad rhetoric. The reason is because you have cherry picked incidents, one from a particularly partisan source, from which to base your claim of a lack of credibility. So we are entirely on the same page. You could name your preferred news source and I could probably do exactly the same :) (also; as noted above - I have no opinion on the Arabic channel, never watched/read it and my Arabic is pretty rusty. They could be different)
  - berntb 16y ago
    >>The reason is because you have cherry picked incidents, one from a particularly partisan source, from which to base your claim of a lack of credibility. AGAIN: You made a claim that the sermon was an isolated event. You have a basis for that claim? Then, the tv program is on the memri web site. There should be at least a million people in your Britain which understands it. Are you really claiming that they completely lied about something so easily checked...? And since you don't have references and are literally claiming the right to say a news source is good, despite not knowing their agenda or how they spin etc, it is fun when you disqualify sources. >>You could name your preferred news source and I could probably do exactly the same :) Disclosure: I almost trust NY Times, as long as none of their big advertisers etc are involved. They have aired lots of scandals in lots of president administrations. I read my local (Swedish) media carefully too, but mainly for the laughs in comparing content to NYT/BBC.
    - ErrantX 16y ago
      > AGAIN: You made a claim that the sermon was an isolated event. You have a basis for that claim? Umm, yes, my using English AJ as a news source. I think I would have noticed if they regularly advocated (note - a distinction from broadcasting) extremist views. :) You, on the other hand, have noted that you have no first hand knowledge of AJ or their reporting. But have taken content from a website that exists to track down examples of anti-Semitic material to inform your view of them... > Are you really claiming that they completely lied about something so easily checked...? No, more bad rhetoric. You know I am not claiming that. I am explaining that they hunt down these clips, often presenting them out of context, with the agenda of exposing news agencies as anti-Semitic. Point being made is; you should definitely treat them as circumspectly as you are treating AJ. > They have aired lots of scandals in lots of president administrations I'm mildly unconvinced that airing scandal is a good marker for neutrality & credibility :) The BBC are pretty good - probably the best "simple" news source, although it has its biases (most notably it is often anti EU). NYT I am always divided over, but generally pretty good. They make up my four "preferred & relatively trustworthy" news sources along with AJ and the Financial Times. There is probably a slight liberal bias in my choice of news consumption, but I have yet to find a conservative media source that I am comfortable with. BUT; you could pick up lots of examples of problems.. the BBC, for example, tends to be very "white middle class Christian" centric (and sometimes, ultra-politically-correct). They also, recently, broadcast some BNP interviews which had pretty nasty/racist comments in them - basically the same sort of lines as the first incident you pointed to with AJ. We picks our source and then take them with a grain of salt. The point is not to find you a "source" to prove Al Jazeera's credibility to you, the point is I am giving you my opinion as a cynic and AJ watcher that I find them to be a relatively neutral and balanced news source. If you have respect for my opinions you might take that as an endorsement, or otherwise you might not :) I don't mind. The points you have raised do concern me; enough that it will be at the back of my mind now when using them as a source, at least in the near future. I'm afraid it is not enough to convince me they are anti-Semitic and completely non-neutral/compromised.

by ErrantX 16y ago

berntb 16y ago

>>you have one incident ... And, as it is, I accept their explanation for it First, do you have a reference to that claim, then? Second, it took me five seconds to find this: "Former Inmate: Guantanamo Jews Used Witchcraft on Prisoners, Made Me Feel a Cat Was Trying to Penetrate Me" http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/0/0/0/0/0/64/2730.htm http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/0/0/0/0/0/64/2730.htm That was a second incident. Or is that just normal Al Jazeera news -- which you claim is one of the best...? Or was that also sent directly without the standard five seconds safety to be able to cut off? :-) Edit: It is problematic with tv, since you can't just check the original language versions by translate.google.com. It do seem to be easy to find lots of weird stuff covered by non-English Al J. Which I think I'll base an opinion on. I'll just note the general lack of references for the claims of credibility.

ErrantX 16y ago
Ahem, If we are talking about bias then MEMRI is possibly the worst source you could have used :) > I'll just note the general lack of references for the claims of credibility. This is unfair, and bad rhetoric. The reason is because you have cherry picked incidents, one from a particularly partisan source, from which to base your claim of a lack of credibility. So we are entirely on the same page. You could name your preferred news source and I could probably do exactly the same :) (also; as noted above - I have no opinion on the Arabic channel, never watched/read it and my Arabic is pretty rusty. They could be different)
- berntb 16y ago
  >>The reason is because you have cherry picked incidents, one from a particularly partisan source, from which to base your claim of a lack of credibility. AGAIN: You made a claim that the sermon was an isolated event. You have a basis for that claim? Then, the tv program is on the memri web site. There should be at least a million people in your Britain which understands it. Are you really claiming that they completely lied about something so easily checked...? And since you don't have references and are literally claiming the right to say a news source is good, despite not knowing their agenda or how they spin etc, it is fun when you disqualify sources. >>You could name your preferred news source and I could probably do exactly the same :) Disclosure: I almost trust NY Times, as long as none of their big advertisers etc are involved. They have aired lots of scandals in lots of president administrations. I read my local (Swedish) media carefully too, but mainly for the laughs in comparing content to NYT/BBC.
  - ErrantX 16y ago
    > AGAIN: You made a claim that the sermon was an isolated event. You have a basis for that claim? Umm, yes, my using English AJ as a news source. I think I would have noticed if they regularly advocated (note - a distinction from broadcasting) extremist views. :) You, on the other hand, have noted that you have no first hand knowledge of AJ or their reporting. But have taken content from a website that exists to track down examples of anti-Semitic material to inform your view of them... > Are you really claiming that they completely lied about something so easily checked...? No, more bad rhetoric. You know I am not claiming that. I am explaining that they hunt down these clips, often presenting them out of context, with the agenda of exposing news agencies as anti-Semitic. Point being made is; you should definitely treat them as circumspectly as you are treating AJ. > They have aired lots of scandals in lots of president administrations I'm mildly unconvinced that airing scandal is a good marker for neutrality & credibility :) The BBC are pretty good - probably the best "simple" news source, although it has its biases (most notably it is often anti EU). NYT I am always divided over, but generally pretty good. They make up my four "preferred & relatively trustworthy" news sources along with AJ and the Financial Times. There is probably a slight liberal bias in my choice of news consumption, but I have yet to find a conservative media source that I am comfortable with. BUT; you could pick up lots of examples of problems.. the BBC, for example, tends to be very "white middle class Christian" centric (and sometimes, ultra-politically-correct). They also, recently, broadcast some BNP interviews which had pretty nasty/racist comments in them - basically the same sort of lines as the first incident you pointed to with AJ. We picks our source and then take them with a grain of salt. The point is not to find you a "source" to prove Al Jazeera's credibility to you, the point is I am giving you my opinion as a cynic and AJ watcher that I find them to be a relatively neutral and balanced news source. If you have respect for my opinions you might take that as an endorsement, or otherwise you might not :) I don't mind. The points you have raised do concern me; enough that it will be at the back of my mind now when using them as a source, at least in the near future. I'm afraid it is not enough to convince me they are anti-Semitic and completely non-neutral/compromised.