4 ms·

For many crimes they just don't bother looking for you because you will eventually need to resolve the issue. This makes it seem like it is easier to hide than

For many crimes they just don't bother looking for you because you will eventually need to resolve the issue. This makes it seem like it is easier to hide than it is, but you're not really hiding. I guess what I am trying to capture is the difference in active vs. passive policing. Have you ever tried to evade the law? You can't get a driver's license or nondriver's identification card, as the warrant prevents you from renewing or they stall you for arrest; you can't apply for social benefits, as you need ID; you can't take most jobs, as they are linked to your identity; and you can't get a passport and often can't leave the country. Going out can be hazardous as even if you don't need to provide ID you might get arrested for not doing so anyway, and social functions may request an ID either for serving alcohol or for admission. If you do get out of the country, you'd have similar or worse problems in Canada, and Mexico is far less amenable to undocumented transients than it used to be. Going further south might be an option but you're now talking about relocating to a different culture at considerable expense. Unless you're a well-off murderer the cost-benefit is not in favor of this.

JohnBooty 7y ago
You've provided a number of wonderful explanations on this thread. As an American who's had zero personal involvement with the justice system, I'd never really stopped to consider the practice of cash bail. Thank you!
sturgill 7y ago
I once had a warrant issued for my arrest because I forgot to take care of a “fix-it” ticket. I got the letter in the mail and even the stress of driving a car was incredible. All it takes is going just a touch too fast and your life would change in an instant. Any whirling lights created intense anxiety. I only lasted about a week after I got the letter before I went to the station on my own time. Technically they were supposed to book me and then process the “fix it” paperwork (burned out headlight!) but in their words “the booking room is full and you’d just be released any way; but maybe next time take care of this faster?” I did send my mom a copy of the letter informing me the warrant for my arrest had been rescinded...
- skinnymuch 7y ago
  Why would your life change so much/in an instant? Does your state mark your arrest for such a minor warrant in some permanent record or such, without being able to do much about it? You’re not being charged for a felony. DUIs are more serious as one example. I don’t know the extent to how you need to inform people like employers about it, but it hasn’t seemed to affect life in the medium or long term for people I know irl. The biggest issue is losing driving privileges for a decent amount of time. Which isn’t likely in your situation. Or the ones I’ve been in.
  - sturgill 7y ago
    I simply didn’t want my car impounded while I was cuffed and put in the back of a police car. These were my undergrad years and I was in a different state studying (loosely defined). And there’s always a permanent record (short of expungement). “The background check for the job shows you were arrested; can you please explain?...” Honestly I don’t know how long stuff like that sticks around. And I’m also glad I never had to find out. It can be a funny story with a framed letter saying there’s no longer a warrant for my arrest. No Rick Perry mugshot pic circulating Facebook...
    - snagglegaggle 7y ago
      It sticks around forever. I'm not aware of any real expungement that exists anymore, too many people got mad that e.g. repeat DUI offenders would be sentenced as if they'd never had a DUI before. There's also 3rd party databases that nothing ever gets removed from. In that case, not great, but in a lot of other cases the situation now is probably worse.
mtnGoat 7y ago
It's actually a lot easier than you'd think. You can move to another state and many problems go away. I've had a number of friends do this to allow the statuate of limitations expire for certain things. For instance if you have a DUI arrest warrant in Washington, I know Arizona and California will still issue you an ID. I think a license too if Washington hasn't convicted you and removed your driving privilege. It's quite easy to hide in other states for most crimes, the bigger the crime, the further you need to go. The problem is that, most jurisdictions don't have the funds/means to come get the person(let alone hold them until they can come), so they don't act on the notification when your name is ran, and don't ask the other party to hold you. I know an executive of a company that has a Florida arrest warrant and travels very freely to every other state. He is not hiding, but he is also not dealing with his Florida issues. I know someone else who left Texas after sentencing, but before checking in to Prison for a decade. She still flies to Texas to see her parents under her new married name. You might be amazed how many people are living in hiding from something.
- wahern 7y ago
  > For instance if you have a DUI arrest warrant in Washington, I know Arizona and California will still issue you an ID. I think a license too if Washington hasn't convicted you and removed your driving privilege. California won't issue you a driver's license. My mother sold her car because of this. About 3 years ago she tried to revert to her maiden name when renewing her driver's license, which resulted in California finding an open Illinois DUI case from the 1970s. As she tells it, there was some miscommunication between her and the DA back then because she didn't realize it was still open until California sent her the renewal rejection.[1] Resolving the DUI from afar would have required more time and expense than she was prepared to spend. Fortunately, by selling her car she solved two problems. She lives in San Francisco. Her apartment building has no parking, so she was street parking. Keeping and parking a car in the city induced too much anxiety. On balance she's happier and healthier taking the bus and walking. She works as a home assistant and can easily find clients close enough to not require transferring buses. For most people outside San Francisco, though, doing this would be (and is!) much more difficult and stressful. (I once worked with an engineer in Sunnyvale who had an open DUI case in Connecticut. He would bike and walk everywhere, which definitely did not make him happier, though perhaps healthier.) Around that same time my dad would have been racking up DUIs across the country. For decades he drove without a driver's license. Fortunately he lived in a small town in Alabama and was friendly with the local police and sheriff's deputies. Elsewhere he relied upon the same strategy as many illegal immigrants: never speed and drive very carefully. He also generally avoided the interstates, which would add many hours to our Thanksgiving road trips from Mobile/Pensacola to Tampa.[2] I think at some point in the 2000s he bit the bullet and resolved things in Alabama, but considering he had (and has) open DUIs in several other states I assume Alabama didn't have reciprocal notification and enforcement. [1] More likely she did what most people have done who end up in the same situation: ignore it and pretend it went away. That was easier back then. [2] My job was to mind the cooler and toss him beers. EDIT: Regarding simply getting an ID, some time after moving to SF my mom needed to get a new ID showing her SF residency to apply for some assistance programs. The DMV wanted a copy of her birth certificate from Illinois; her Social Security card and Massachusetts license weren't enough, I guess. I don't really know what the problem was, but apparently she spent several hours playing phone tag and then learned it was going to cost some surprising amount of money. I would have paid the money, but at that point I guess she was fed up and fell back on her old "ignore it" strategy. Fortunately (again), San Francisco had begun issuing city IDs, partly for the benefit of undocumented immigrants. Her city ID sufficed for her immediate needs. I don't know if she ever got a copy of that birth certificate, but she did eventually get a California driver's license. Anyhow, apropos stricter voter ID laws, people shouldn't assume getting an ID is so convenient as to not constitute any sort of burden, especially if you're under time constraints, such as when showing up to a polling station and being told you need a different form of identification than you had been using for years.

JohnBooty 7y ago

You've provided a number of wonderful explanations on this thread. As an American who's had zero personal involvement with the justice system, I'd never really stopped to consider the practice of cash bail. Thank you!

sturgill 7y ago

I once had a warrant issued for my arrest because I forgot to take care of a “fix-it” ticket. I got the letter in the mail and even the stress of driving a car was incredible. All it takes is going just a touch too fast and your life would change in an instant. Any whirling lights created intense anxiety. I only lasted about a week after I got the letter before I went to the station on my own time. Technically they were supposed to book me and then process the “fix it” paperwork (burned out headlight!) but in their words “the booking room is full and you’d just be released any way; but maybe next time take care of this faster?” I did send my mom a copy of the letter informing me the warrant for my arrest had been rescinded...

skinnymuch 7y ago
Why would your life change so much/in an instant? Does your state mark your arrest for such a minor warrant in some permanent record or such, without being able to do much about it? You’re not being charged for a felony. DUIs are more serious as one example. I don’t know the extent to how you need to inform people like employers about it, but it hasn’t seemed to affect life in the medium or long term for people I know irl. The biggest issue is losing driving privileges for a decent amount of time. Which isn’t likely in your situation. Or the ones I’ve been in.
- sturgill 7y ago
  I simply didn’t want my car impounded while I was cuffed and put in the back of a police car. These were my undergrad years and I was in a different state studying (loosely defined). And there’s always a permanent record (short of expungement). “The background check for the job shows you were arrested; can you please explain?...” Honestly I don’t know how long stuff like that sticks around. And I’m also glad I never had to find out. It can be a funny story with a framed letter saying there’s no longer a warrant for my arrest. No Rick Perry mugshot pic circulating Facebook...
  - snagglegaggle 7y ago
    It sticks around forever. I'm not aware of any real expungement that exists anymore, too many people got mad that e.g. repeat DUI offenders would be sentenced as if they'd never had a DUI before. There's also 3rd party databases that nothing ever gets removed from. In that case, not great, but in a lot of other cases the situation now is probably worse.

mtnGoat 7y ago

It's actually a lot easier than you'd think. You can move to another state and many problems go away. I've had a number of friends do this to allow the statuate of limitations expire for certain things. For instance if you have a DUI arrest warrant in Washington, I know Arizona and California will still issue you an ID. I think a license too if Washington hasn't convicted you and removed your driving privilege. It's quite easy to hide in other states for most crimes, the bigger the crime, the further you need to go. The problem is that, most jurisdictions don't have the funds/means to come get the person(let alone hold them until they can come), so they don't act on the notification when your name is ran, and don't ask the other party to hold you. I know an executive of a company that has a Florida arrest warrant and travels very freely to every other state. He is not hiding, but he is also not dealing with his Florida issues. I know someone else who left Texas after sentencing, but before checking in to Prison for a decade. She still flies to Texas to see her parents under her new married name. You might be amazed how many people are living in hiding from something.

wahern 7y ago
> For instance if you have a DUI arrest warrant in Washington, I know Arizona and California will still issue you an ID. I think a license too if Washington hasn't convicted you and removed your driving privilege. California won't issue you a driver's license. My mother sold her car because of this. About 3 years ago she tried to revert to her maiden name when renewing her driver's license, which resulted in California finding an open Illinois DUI case from the 1970s. As she tells it, there was some miscommunication between her and the DA back then because she didn't realize it was still open until California sent her the renewal rejection.[1] Resolving the DUI from afar would have required more time and expense than she was prepared to spend. Fortunately, by selling her car she solved two problems. She lives in San Francisco. Her apartment building has no parking, so she was street parking. Keeping and parking a car in the city induced too much anxiety. On balance she's happier and healthier taking the bus and walking. She works as a home assistant and can easily find clients close enough to not require transferring buses. For most people outside San Francisco, though, doing this would be (and is!) much more difficult and stressful. (I once worked with an engineer in Sunnyvale who had an open DUI case in Connecticut. He would bike and walk everywhere, which definitely did not make him happier, though perhaps healthier.) Around that same time my dad would have been racking up DUIs across the country. For decades he drove without a driver's license. Fortunately he lived in a small town in Alabama and was friendly with the local police and sheriff's deputies. Elsewhere he relied upon the same strategy as many illegal immigrants: never speed and drive very carefully. He also generally avoided the interstates, which would add many hours to our Thanksgiving road trips from Mobile/Pensacola to Tampa.[2] I think at some point in the 2000s he bit the bullet and resolved things in Alabama, but considering he had (and has) open DUIs in several other states I assume Alabama didn't have reciprocal notification and enforcement. [1] More likely she did what most people have done who end up in the same situation: ignore it and pretend it went away. That was easier back then. [2] My job was to mind the cooler and toss him beers. EDIT: Regarding simply getting an ID, some time after moving to SF my mom needed to get a new ID showing her SF residency to apply for some assistance programs. The DMV wanted a copy of her birth certificate from Illinois; her Social Security card and Massachusetts license weren't enough, I guess. I don't really know what the problem was, but apparently she spent several hours playing phone tag and then learned it was going to cost some surprising amount of money. I would have paid the money, but at that point I guess she was fed up and fell back on her old "ignore it" strategy. Fortunately (again), San Francisco had begun issuing city IDs, partly for the benefit of undocumented immigrants. Her city ID sufficed for her immediate needs. I don't know if she ever got a copy of that birth certificate, but she did eventually get a California driver's license. Anyhow, apropos stricter voter ID laws, people shouldn't assume getting an ID is so convenient as to not constitute any sort of burden, especially if you're under time constraints, such as when showing up to a polling station and being told you need a different form of identification than you had been using for years.