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> a ton of people are making it through the education system without learning anything at all Well people learn something. What is interesting in the NCES nati

> a ton of people are making it through the education system without learning anything at all Well people learn something. What is interesting in the NCES national literacy surveys they've consistently found that around 45% of adults who didn't graduate high school are illiterate, about 20% of adults who did graduate high school (but no further schooling) are illiterate, and about 10% of the population overall is illiterate. There's also non-zero illiteracy results for various levels of college graduates, ranging from 1 to 4% depending on the degree level. Now these students that are graduating high school and college illiterate are extremely interesting. What's going on? Do they have incredible memorization skills and learn from listening to books on tape? Or have they selected degrees and colleges where literacy is not required, perhaps an art or physical education major or something of the kind at a small private college. They are submitting at least some papers and taking tests in their classes most likely. Papers can be bought or ghost authored, is that happening to the extent that illiterates can get a degree? Test taking, perhaps some professors will give everyone a passing grade just for attending even if they turn in blank tests. Is that happening? Or perhaps the illiterate people self-reporting to NCES that they have a Masters degree (1% of Masters degrees holders are illiterate) are lying either about about their degrees or intentionally failing the literacy testing just because they thought it was funny? At the high school level though I am pretty sure the case of large numbers of illiterate graduates is that a lot of schools pass you with Gentleman's C's just for showing up, remaining quiet and obedient, avoiding fights, and not causing any disturbances or problems for the teachers. If you do this and don't turn in a single assignment and guess randomly on all tests you can graduate from many US high schools. I have met several illiterate high school graduates so I know it is a real thing that happens. They all had great personalities. Some of them are successful business owners. Graduating illiterate might require some people skills.

Avshalom 7y ago
It's worth poking around the sample questions on that literacy survey: https://nces.ed.gov/NAAL/sample_results.asp https://nces.ed.gov/NAAL/sample_results.asp they're not using literacy in the sense of just being able to read english prose. I, at least, can see how you might fuck up the survey but still be able to muddle through writing a couple pages on Duchamp's Fountain, it wouldn't be easy but 1 in 100? yeah sure.
- droithomme 7y ago
  Hey yeah in the study methodology they do a 7 question simple screener at the beginning. Those with poor scores do not take the questions you mention which are intended for people who definitely have basic literacy. They instead do a test involving someone sits with them and shows them photos of laundry detergent and asks what's the name of the brand. If it's Era and the person says Tide that's a half-credit, if they say Tide it's a full credit. And so on. It's to determine exactly how bad are things. But even with the test you mention you and I would definitely score far far above the "Below Basic" level that is a comparable term to illiterate. Sure they can recognize their own name and the word cat and dog, but they can't read a sentence in any newspaper or make sense of it.

Avshalom 7y ago

It's worth poking around the sample questions on that literacy survey: https://nces.ed.gov/NAAL/sample_results.asp https://nces.ed.gov/NAAL/sample_results.asp they're not using literacy in the sense of just being able to read english prose. I, at least, can see how you might fuck up the survey but still be able to muddle through writing a couple pages on Duchamp's Fountain, it wouldn't be easy but 1 in 100? yeah sure.

droithomme 7y ago
Hey yeah in the study methodology they do a 7 question simple screener at the beginning. Those with poor scores do not take the questions you mention which are intended for people who definitely have basic literacy. They instead do a test involving someone sits with them and shows them photos of laundry detergent and asks what's the name of the brand. If it's Era and the person says Tide that's a half-credit, if they say Tide it's a full credit. And so on. It's to determine exactly how bad are things. But even with the test you mention you and I would definitely score far far above the "Below Basic" level that is a comparable term to illiterate. Sure they can recognize their own name and the word cat and dog, but they can't read a sentence in any newspaper or make sense of it.