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My grand mother was born in 1894 and was tenth of eleven children. She spent here early years on a farm helping with her younger brother. She attended school un

My grand mother was born in 1894 and was tenth of eleven children. She spent here early years on a farm helping with her younger brother. She attended school until the 4th grade. At 11-years-old, she was working full time in a cotton mill. At 14 she had her first child. My grandmother and grandfather maintained a farm while both worked in the mill. Mornings started at 4:30am six days a week. Grandma had a picture with all of the young girls at the mill, and would always point out a couple of the unmarried girls who were 16 in the picture and say that they were old maids. It is possible, maybe likely, that we have extended childhood too far, and I am sure that given the right upbringing, my 11-year-old daughter could function just as well as my grandmother, but I have not prepared my daughter for that type of life. My daughter has never been required to start the day with chores; she has never been responsible for others. If we are going to change how we treat teens, we need to start a lot younger and change how we raise children.

simonsarris 7y ago
I plan to do this: Give my kids lots of responsibility from a very very early age, starting with collecting small sticks to start the fire every morning (we heat with a wood stove). By teenage years they should be able to make things to sell or gift to others. My wife currently nannies children and her "field notes" are just incredible. Children want to have responsibility. They want to have jobs. Not that I'm suggesting they go into factory work, but there's no reason a 12 year old can't learn to start perfecting something like a croissant. Instead if young kids clamor for something to do, some parents do stuff like help them setup a lemonade stand. This is hardly DOING something, its mostly sitting there waiting for cars(???) to stop so they can sell sugar water. It is already below their skill level and a waste when they could be learning something more meaningful. We have definitely extended childhood too far. We basically park child bodies into little feedlots called schools, which seems generally to only be because of a total lack of imagination on the part of adults. Children should be DOING things. https://twitter.com/simonsarris/status/1192477007986221057 https://twitter.com/simonsarris/status/1192477007986221057
- WalterGR 7y ago
  > Children want to have responsibility. This article made the rounds last year: Families In A Maya Village In Mexico May Have The Secret To Getting Kids To Do Chores - NPR https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2018/06/09/616928895/how-to-get-your-kids-to-do-chores-without-resenting-it https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2018/06/09/6169288... Discussion here on HN, with 382 points and 202 comments: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17280710 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17280710 (Disclaimer: Having read neither, I cannot vouch for their contents.)
tenebrisalietum 7y ago
Devil's advocate mode: Extending childhood is related to spending a lot of time preparing children to do things other than what they grow up with. This is necessary for a resilient society that is something more than a collection of family farms and for social mobility. This extended "training time" is less necessary if A) you live in a preindustrialized society where you aren't expected to spend a significant amount of your life working for an employer, and B) all you are going to do is what your parents are doing on the same property they live on.
- threwawasy1228 7y ago
  This was my initial thought as well. While farmwork and other aspects of rural living is wildly complex, when you have everything pre-setup for you it is easy to learn everything you need to know from an early age. OTOH, when your modern parents leave you with no setup direction for you to follow, and you have to invent your own direction, it takes much more time to build toward that. Imagine a kid living in the suburbs that wants to do this sort of independent farmwork and self sustaining life from scratch without family support, vs a the child of a farmer.

simonsarris 7y ago

I plan to do this: Give my kids lots of responsibility from a very very early age, starting with collecting small sticks to start the fire every morning (we heat with a wood stove). By teenage years they should be able to make things to sell or gift to others. My wife currently nannies children and her "field notes" are just incredible. Children want to have responsibility. They want to have jobs. Not that I'm suggesting they go into factory work, but there's no reason a 12 year old can't learn to start perfecting something like a croissant. Instead if young kids clamor for something to do, some parents do stuff like help them setup a lemonade stand. This is hardly DOING something, its mostly sitting there waiting for cars(???) to stop so they can sell sugar water. It is already below their skill level and a waste when they could be learning something more meaningful. We have definitely extended childhood too far. We basically park child bodies into little feedlots called schools, which seems generally to only be because of a total lack of imagination on the part of adults. Children should be DOING things. https://twitter.com/simonsarris/status/1192477007986221057 https://twitter.com/simonsarris/status/1192477007986221057

WalterGR 7y ago
> Children want to have responsibility. This article made the rounds last year: Families In A Maya Village In Mexico May Have The Secret To Getting Kids To Do Chores - NPR https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2018/06/09/616928895/how-to-get-your-kids-to-do-chores-without-resenting-it https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2018/06/09/6169288... Discussion here on HN, with 382 points and 202 comments: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17280710 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17280710 (Disclaimer: Having read neither, I cannot vouch for their contents.)

tenebrisalietum 7y ago

Devil's advocate mode: Extending childhood is related to spending a lot of time preparing children to do things other than what they grow up with. This is necessary for a resilient society that is something more than a collection of family farms and for social mobility. This extended "training time" is less necessary if A) you live in a preindustrialized society where you aren't expected to spend a significant amount of your life working for an employer, and B) all you are going to do is what your parents are doing on the same property they live on.

threwawasy1228 7y ago
This was my initial thought as well. While farmwork and other aspects of rural living is wildly complex, when you have everything pre-setup for you it is easy to learn everything you need to know from an early age. OTOH, when your modern parents leave you with no setup direction for you to follow, and you have to invent your own direction, it takes much more time to build toward that. Imagine a kid living in the suburbs that wants to do this sort of independent farmwork and self sustaining life from scratch without family support, vs a the child of a farmer.