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> Plus, the reason teens are not considered adults is not that their IQ would be low. The reason is impulsivity and similar considerations. Maybe what we call

> Plus, the reason teens are not considered adults is not that their IQ would be low. The reason is impulsivity and similar considerations. Maybe what we call "impulsivity" is just an healthy reaction against absurd constraints and monotony? We forget very easily that we are animals, and the way we have been living for the last few centuries is radically different from the way we were evolved to live. Perhaps factory-like schooling is inherently painful, and what we call "adulthood" is just learned helplessness...

orbital-decay 7y ago
People in traditional societies are also impulsive in that age. Besides, other mammals have the same transient period as well, from the domesticated (dogs) to the wild ones. It'not just modern human society.
watwut 7y ago
1.) My life was way less monotonous when I was a teenager. The most monotonous period started when I had children. You dont get more monotonous then that currently. In school, at least you learn about something different every day and can do different things during breaks or read or play games. 2.) Before factory like schooling, I guess we mean feudalism and traditional farm households, teenagers were not free at all by any meaningful definition of that word. No one was. 3.) How far exactly in history do you want to go? Because you really have to go so far that we dont really know how people lived. But, it might involve getting pregnant at 14 by a strong dude who decides restrictions placed on you due to being stronger.
- jtolmar 7y ago
  Medieval peasants (and serfs) had a lot of freedom with how to spend their day to day. They had chores, and several weeks a year of grueling sun up to sun down labor. But it's not usually harvest season or planting season, and they had nearly half the year off. Working hours increased dramatically during the industrial revolution.
  - watwut 7y ago
    Winter was not off. You still have to care about animals and you still have to care about tools and you still have to cook and care about toddlers and babies. You still need to sew cloth, create shoes, create candles, feather-bed and what not.
- normalnorm 7y ago
  > My life was way less monotonous when I was a teenager. The most monotonous period started when I had children. I'm not surprised. Childhood became serious business in the last couple of decades, children have all of their time structured and are working for their CV seconds after going through their mother's vagina. I watch in horror the life of my friends who have children. It's an endless grind of extra-curricular activities and soul-crushing corporatized birthday "parties". > Before factory like schooling, I guess we mean feudalism and traditional farm households, teenagers were not free at all by any meaningful definition of that word. No one was. This is the kind of History we learn in high school in the west, but the reality was quite different. People where much freer in many senses, for example most of their time was not dictated by someone else. I am not saying that we should go back to more primitive ways of living, but it is absolutely not a binary choice between modernity and feudalism, and there are ways in which we regressed. > How far exactly in history do you want to go? I want to go forward, not backwards. To do that, it is important to see our overarching History as a species in context, at different time scales and so on. Modernity is horrible in many ways, I am an idealist and I believe that we can do better. If we are sufficiently smart and open-minded.
  - watwut 7y ago
    > I watch in horror the life of my friends who have children. It's an endless grind of extra-curricular activities and soul-crushing corporatized birthday "parties". It is monotonous long before then. It becomes routine and monotony right after birth, when they are babies and toddlers. The birthday parties are step out of monotony already and are extra-curricular activities - which they quite often transport themselves from and to and by which time you are already returning to normal life. > People where much freer in many senses, for example most of their time was not dictated by someone else. Young people were expected to listen to parents and live with them. You had to care about about animals if you had them, siblings, own children, craft needed stuff and generally work a lot. You would not be able to wake up whenever you wanted.

orbital-decay 7y ago

People in traditional societies are also impulsive in that age. Besides, other mammals have the same transient period as well, from the domesticated (dogs) to the wild ones. It'not just modern human society.

watwut 7y ago

1.) My life was way less monotonous when I was a teenager. The most monotonous period started when I had children. You dont get more monotonous then that currently. In school, at least you learn about something different every day and can do different things during breaks or read or play games. 2.) Before factory like schooling, I guess we mean feudalism and traditional farm households, teenagers were not free at all by any meaningful definition of that word. No one was. 3.) How far exactly in history do you want to go? Because you really have to go so far that we dont really know how people lived. But, it might involve getting pregnant at 14 by a strong dude who decides restrictions placed on you due to being stronger.

jtolmar 7y ago
Medieval peasants (and serfs) had a lot of freedom with how to spend their day to day. They had chores, and several weeks a year of grueling sun up to sun down labor. But it's not usually harvest season or planting season, and they had nearly half the year off. Working hours increased dramatically during the industrial revolution.
- watwut 7y ago
  Winter was not off. You still have to care about animals and you still have to care about tools and you still have to cook and care about toddlers and babies. You still need to sew cloth, create shoes, create candles, feather-bed and what not.
normalnorm 7y ago
> My life was way less monotonous when I was a teenager. The most monotonous period started when I had children. I'm not surprised. Childhood became serious business in the last couple of decades, children have all of their time structured and are working for their CV seconds after going through their mother's vagina. I watch in horror the life of my friends who have children. It's an endless grind of extra-curricular activities and soul-crushing corporatized birthday "parties". > Before factory like schooling, I guess we mean feudalism and traditional farm households, teenagers were not free at all by any meaningful definition of that word. No one was. This is the kind of History we learn in high school in the west, but the reality was quite different. People where much freer in many senses, for example most of their time was not dictated by someone else. I am not saying that we should go back to more primitive ways of living, but it is absolutely not a binary choice between modernity and feudalism, and there are ways in which we regressed. > How far exactly in history do you want to go? I want to go forward, not backwards. To do that, it is important to see our overarching History as a species in context, at different time scales and so on. Modernity is horrible in many ways, I am an idealist and I believe that we can do better. If we are sufficiently smart and open-minded.
- watwut 7y ago
  > I watch in horror the life of my friends who have children. It's an endless grind of extra-curricular activities and soul-crushing corporatized birthday "parties". It is monotonous long before then. It becomes routine and monotony right after birth, when they are babies and toddlers. The birthday parties are step out of monotony already and are extra-curricular activities - which they quite often transport themselves from and to and by which time you are already returning to normal life. > People where much freer in many senses, for example most of their time was not dictated by someone else. Young people were expected to listen to parents and live with them. You had to care about about animals if you had them, siblings, own children, craft needed stuff and generally work a lot. You would not be able to wake up whenever you wanted.