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Did you ask her why? It doesn't outwardly seem pragmatic if she's happy to forego expense which provide a service or experience, but not a piece of stone that

Did you ask her why? It doesn't outwardly seem pragmatic if she's happy to forego expense which provide a service or experience, but not a piece of stone that weighs less than a gram and serves no function other than to display wealth. You'd be better spending that money on a fancy sports car - at least you'd get some fun out of it and a fair resale value.

slig 7y ago
> and serves no function other than to display wealth That's the point: signal to peers that you've found a great partner that's willing to throw this kind of money away just for your status.
- agent008t 7y ago
  Why is signalling that to peers useful or a good thing?
  - ableal 7y ago
    That's been thought out a while ago: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_good https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_good
  - austhrow743 7y ago
    Makes you feel good.
- harimau777 7y ago
  I suppose you could accomplish the same thing by just not telling people that it's moissanite.
  - lelima 7y ago
    I think most girls check somehow the ring/diamond value.
    - harimau777 7y ago
      My bad, I meant the girl not telling other people. I'm not sure it bodes well for the relationship if the guy doesn't tell the girl!
- rubber_duck 7y ago
  It's more about what it says to your partner, commitment through sacrifice and ability to provide
  - lazylizard 7y ago
    Buy her a house? Buy insurance? Put all your pay into a joint bank account?
    - lmm 7y ago
      If you buy something that's directly useful then you (in the general case) risk being exploited. By buying something that can't be used or resold, you give the signal but in a "safe" way.
chongli 7y ago
serves no function other than to display wealth That’s not true. The far greater purpose is for the man to signal commitment to his bride. By spending a lot of money, especially if it’s not easy for you to afford it, you signal to her that you are seriously committed to her. You signal that you trust her with something very expensive that would not be easy for you to replace. You can’t bypass that sort of thing. If the price of diamonds collapsed completely then we’d need to find something else to replace them.
- RankingMember 7y ago
  > You signal that you trust her with something very expensive that would not be easy for you to replace.[...] You can’t bypass that sort of thing. Is committing to spending your life with someone not trusting them with something that wouldn't be easy for you to replace? What's more irreplaceable than the years of your own life? Not every couple gets a diamond engagement ring or precious metal wedding rings (the prevalence is trending downward) and I've heard no studies that establish correlation between successful marriages and diamond engagement rings. Your line of thought is very lucrative for corporations like deBeers, however.
  - chongli 7y ago
    Is committing to spending your life with someone not trusting them with something that wouldn't be easy for you to replace And how does she know you’re committed if you’re not willing to risk anything up front? You can say “well she knows me! We’ve been dating for years!” but then you balk at trusting her with something valuable? Maybe she doesn’t really know you. Maybe things are great now, when nobody has committed anything of value, but will it work when things get tough? Of course a diamond’s no guarantee of that. It’s only a starting point. What's more irreplaceable than the years of your own life We’re talking about the beginning of a married relationship: the engagement. When people talk about engagement rings, they don’t look at dollar figures, they look at number of weeks salary. That is the point! You’re putting time into the relationship up front. Think of it like putting a down payment on a house. Your line of thought is very lucrative for corporations like deBeers, however There are plenty of other diamond sources besides deBeers. Lots of people are buying diamonds mined in the Canadian arctic, for example. They have the added benefit that you know they aren’t conflict diamonds. People do this research when buying diamonds these days! When your fiancée is showing the ring to her friends, if she can tell them a story about all of this research you put into it, then it means even more to her.
Angostura 7y ago
Symbolism is a thing. There's no actual need or pragmatic need for a engagement or wedding ring - or wedding for that matter. These things are symbols that ascribe value to a person and a relationship. Getting it made out of plastic rather than gold goes not carry the same symbolism.
- turk73 7y ago
  Yup, symbolism. Gold and precious stones are eternal in some ways.
beagle3 7y ago
It’s the bitcoin of yestercentury. It doesn’t display wealth - it proves effort has been spent for something that’s mostly (or entirely) useless. Quite, but not exactly sunk cost. People are willing to give something up for proof of effort; a personal union, or something else of value. Whenever someone tells me bitcoin is a scam and has no intrinsic value, I ask them about diamonds, expensive art, etc. Most people cannot reconcile bitcoin and diamonds (as jewelery) in the same value frame. Diamonds do have some functional uses of course, as does gold. But their price is wholly determined by the belief (whether justified or not) that they cannot easily be manufactured on demand. Just like bitcoin.
- ryanmercer 7y ago
  >It’s the bitcoin of yestercentury. It doesn’t display wealth - it proves effort has been spent for something that’s mostly (or entirely) useless. Quite, but not exactly sunk cost. I really like that, bitcoin as the diamond of yesteryear. Effectively finite, has to be mined, only has value/importance because a group of people assign it one, has limited practical use (diamonds as abrasives mostly, bitcoin as a cookie crumb record of transactions) is seen as foolish/wasteful by others, you can't use either for practical trade as the vast majority of individuals/companies don't accept either for trade and both could easily be rendered worthless by a technological advancement or social change.
  - ncmncm 7y ago
    The analogy is closer than you might imagine. The rock is not at all rare, and the bitcoins are often mined with other peoples' money.
- bn7t 7y ago
  To be fair with bitcoin you can at least pay (in some places). Also the worth of bitcoin is (kinda) backed by the worth of the electricty which is used to mine blocks (and consequently new bitcoins).
  - nathantotten 7y ago
notzuck 7y ago
> ask her why? Sometimes that's 'just the way it is' and being an aspie fucking developer INTP type person you cannot wrap your head around it. Most normal people do 'normal' things and can't justify why.
- Konnstann 7y ago
  That's not normal, and pointing out that "just the way it is" is terrible reasoning doesn't make you an aspie. Maybe if more people had these conversations we'd have fewer terrible industries.
  - throwaway35784 7y ago
    I had that conversation with a doctor. She wanted a diamond. She knew ALL the issues with diamonds. I said, "and knowing all that, kids arms hacked off, you still want a diamond?" "Yes!!" And she was giddy at the prospect. I felt confirmation in that moment for having broken up her years before that. Another few years after that conversation she got her diamond -- after gaining 100lbs and getting a boob job. I really don't understand how some people think.
    - seeker61 7y ago
      Come, my good fellow. Don't exaggerate. I'd bet good money that she didn't gain an ounce over ninety pounds.
cjcole 7y ago
I asked a peahen why she insists on such an extravagant tail in a peacock: totally useless. She just looked at me coldly and strutted away.
- Chirael 7y ago
  If you have to ask, you don't understand.
- ncmncm 7y ago
  Perhaps surprisingly, peahens don't give a hoot about the tail. It's there to intimidate the other males, who do.

slig 7y ago

> and serves no function other than to display wealth That's the point: signal to peers that you've found a great partner that's willing to throw this kind of money away just for your status.

agent008t 7y ago
Why is signalling that to peers useful or a good thing?
- ableal 7y ago
  That's been thought out a while ago: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_good https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_good
- austhrow743 7y ago
  Makes you feel good.
harimau777 7y ago
I suppose you could accomplish the same thing by just not telling people that it's moissanite.
- lelima 7y ago
  I think most girls check somehow the ring/diamond value.
  - harimau777 7y ago
    My bad, I meant the girl not telling other people. I'm not sure it bodes well for the relationship if the guy doesn't tell the girl!
rubber_duck 7y ago
It's more about what it says to your partner, commitment through sacrifice and ability to provide
- lazylizard 7y ago
  Buy her a house? Buy insurance? Put all your pay into a joint bank account?
  - lmm 7y ago
    If you buy something that's directly useful then you (in the general case) risk being exploited. By buying something that can't be used or resold, you give the signal but in a "safe" way.

chongli 7y ago

serves no function other than to display wealth That’s not true. The far greater purpose is for the man to signal commitment to his bride. By spending a lot of money, especially if it’s not easy for you to afford it, you signal to her that you are seriously committed to her. You signal that you trust her with something very expensive that would not be easy for you to replace. You can’t bypass that sort of thing. If the price of diamonds collapsed completely then we’d need to find something else to replace them.

RankingMember 7y ago
> You signal that you trust her with something very expensive that would not be easy for you to replace.[...] You can’t bypass that sort of thing. Is committing to spending your life with someone not trusting them with something that wouldn't be easy for you to replace? What's more irreplaceable than the years of your own life? Not every couple gets a diamond engagement ring or precious metal wedding rings (the prevalence is trending downward) and I've heard no studies that establish correlation between successful marriages and diamond engagement rings. Your line of thought is very lucrative for corporations like deBeers, however.
- chongli 7y ago
  Is committing to spending your life with someone not trusting them with something that wouldn't be easy for you to replace And how does she know you’re committed if you’re not willing to risk anything up front? You can say “well she knows me! We’ve been dating for years!” but then you balk at trusting her with something valuable? Maybe she doesn’t really know you. Maybe things are great now, when nobody has committed anything of value, but will it work when things get tough? Of course a diamond’s no guarantee of that. It’s only a starting point. What's more irreplaceable than the years of your own life We’re talking about the beginning of a married relationship: the engagement. When people talk about engagement rings, they don’t look at dollar figures, they look at number of weeks salary. That is the point! You’re putting time into the relationship up front. Think of it like putting a down payment on a house. Your line of thought is very lucrative for corporations like deBeers, however There are plenty of other diamond sources besides deBeers. Lots of people are buying diamonds mined in the Canadian arctic, for example. They have the added benefit that you know they aren’t conflict diamonds. People do this research when buying diamonds these days! When your fiancée is showing the ring to her friends, if she can tell them a story about all of this research you put into it, then it means even more to her.

Angostura 7y ago

Symbolism is a thing. There's no actual need or pragmatic need for a engagement or wedding ring - or wedding for that matter. These things are symbols that ascribe value to a person and a relationship. Getting it made out of plastic rather than gold goes not carry the same symbolism.

turk73 7y ago
Yup, symbolism. Gold and precious stones are eternal in some ways.

beagle3 7y ago

It’s the bitcoin of yestercentury. It doesn’t display wealth - it proves effort has been spent for something that’s mostly (or entirely) useless. Quite, but not exactly sunk cost. People are willing to give something up for proof of effort; a personal union, or something else of value. Whenever someone tells me bitcoin is a scam and has no intrinsic value, I ask them about diamonds, expensive art, etc. Most people cannot reconcile bitcoin and diamonds (as jewelery) in the same value frame. Diamonds do have some functional uses of course, as does gold. But their price is wholly determined by the belief (whether justified or not) that they cannot easily be manufactured on demand. Just like bitcoin.

ryanmercer 7y ago
>It’s the bitcoin of yestercentury. It doesn’t display wealth - it proves effort has been spent for something that’s mostly (or entirely) useless. Quite, but not exactly sunk cost. I really like that, bitcoin as the diamond of yesteryear. Effectively finite, has to be mined, only has value/importance because a group of people assign it one, has limited practical use (diamonds as abrasives mostly, bitcoin as a cookie crumb record of transactions) is seen as foolish/wasteful by others, you can't use either for practical trade as the vast majority of individuals/companies don't accept either for trade and both could easily be rendered worthless by a technological advancement or social change.
- ncmncm 7y ago
  The analogy is closer than you might imagine. The rock is not at all rare, and the bitcoins are often mined with other peoples' money.
bn7t 7y ago
To be fair with bitcoin you can at least pay (in some places). Also the worth of bitcoin is (kinda) backed by the worth of the electricty which is used to mine blocks (and consequently new bitcoins).
- nathantotten 7y ago

notzuck 7y ago

> ask her why? Sometimes that's 'just the way it is' and being an aspie fucking developer INTP type person you cannot wrap your head around it. Most normal people do 'normal' things and can't justify why.

Konnstann 7y ago
That's not normal, and pointing out that "just the way it is" is terrible reasoning doesn't make you an aspie. Maybe if more people had these conversations we'd have fewer terrible industries.
- throwaway35784 7y ago
  I had that conversation with a doctor. She wanted a diamond. She knew ALL the issues with diamonds. I said, "and knowing all that, kids arms hacked off, you still want a diamond?" "Yes!!" And she was giddy at the prospect. I felt confirmation in that moment for having broken up her years before that. Another few years after that conversation she got her diamond -- after gaining 100lbs and getting a boob job. I really don't understand how some people think.
  - seeker61 7y ago
    Come, my good fellow. Don't exaggerate. I'd bet good money that she didn't gain an ounce over ninety pounds.

cjcole 7y ago

I asked a peahen why she insists on such an extravagant tail in a peacock: totally useless. She just looked at me coldly and strutted away.

Chirael 7y ago
If you have to ask, you don't understand.
ncmncm 7y ago
Perhaps surprisingly, peahens don't give a hoot about the tail. It's there to intimidate the other males, who do.