5 ms·

> Google also has a clause in their employment agreement that says you agree to them putting surveillance software on your devices, company supplied and persona

by defen 7y ago

> Google also has a clause in their employment agreement that says you agree to them putting surveillance software on your devices, company supplied and personal, as a condition of your employment. How would Google even know about your personal devices? That seems to only make sense if you intend to use your personal device for work.

manfredo 7y ago
It's not even an unusual condition. At Dropbox, starting some time in either 2018 or 2019 we had to install a remote administration app on our devices if we wanted to connect to corp vpn or to log into corporate google accounts. Mostly so that the device could be wiped if it was lost, IIRC.
- daemin 7y ago
  Another reason not to have work email, chat, or any other work system on your personal phone/pc/etc. I think it is a good incentive to disconnect from the workplace.
- ethbro 7y ago
  Yeah, that's pretty normal for campus network access. Otherwise it kind of defies the logic of having a corporate network in the first place. It's definitely a slippery slope though. "If we already have a privileged app running on people's devices... {insert management-centric ask}"
- ryanmercer 7y ago
  When I did some contract work for a big crypto exchange, they required you to provide them the ability to remote wipe any device you used, including your personal phone, for their systems. Since they required you to use Authy I just used an old phone with a throwaway gmail account to set Android up and the beat-to-hell Chromebook they provided that would not hold a charge for more than a few minutes.
jcrites 7y ago
The Google policy probably applies to personal devices used in BYOD work settings. Lots of people at tech companies use personal devices for work. This includes things like having your work calendar, email, or corporate applications on your personal phone. In my company's case there is some kind of enterprise iOS policy that gets installed as part of onboarding a device to access company systems. This has the ability to enforce a password policy, monitor installed software and software versions, to lock out devices that are running known vulnerable apps or iOS versions, as well as the technical ability to remotely wipe the entire device (never heard of that being exercised). Company data resides on the device (via email, documents, and other means) so it's reasonable for them to want to have some oversight. An attacker could attempt to get into company systems via the device, after all, since it has (some limited) access to my corporate account. I use my personal phone for work because it's extremely handy to have work email and calendar on my phone, and I don't want to carry two phones.
- sjg007 7y ago
  Google gives you a phone I think...
- oarsinsync 7y ago
  > I use my personal phone for work because it's extremely handy to have work email and calendar on my phone, and I don't want to carry two phones. I invite my personal calendar to any work events that I need to be aware of when I'm not at work. Otherwise, when I leave the office, I leave work there too. I'm extremely fortunate to be able to do that. It's tragic that my good fortune isn't an option for many.
dvfjsdhgfv 7y ago
This is quite normal BYOD security policy. If you don't intend to use your personal devices for anything work-related (connecting to the same network, using related accounts) this policy shouldn't apply at all.
throwaway8720 7y ago
I don't think the reply is about BYOD... There is speculation about IMSI catchers being used to target personal cell phones without any BYOD app installed. Didn't a whistleblower at a car company suggest this... https://www.theverge.com/2019/3/13/18263757/tesla-elon-musk-employee-hack-spying-whistleblower-gigafactory-martin-tripp-drugs https://www.theverge.com/2019/3/13/18263757/tesla-elon-musk-... And if such a a company had that technology then we can only speculate its use is more widespread than imagined. Maybe this is the only reason remote jobs are not available at these companies... Nothing to do with being onsite just more of a precaution to vet employees before even allowing them to be remote. So if a company could capture your personal text messages and personal cell phone calls while within an office campus (and no BYOD app installed)... would they use that knowledge to prevent poaching as well? Be careful.
ChuckMcM 7y ago
Not BYOD devices, any device you use to connect to the corporate servers. So if you read your corp email on your home computer, or access employee only services from your phone or laptop etc. One of the interesting things about working there was that much of what you needed to do could be done over the existing Google services. As for how? It was left unspecified but we speculated they could drop a keylogger or other bit of surveillance kit if you logged into your corporate gmail account from a device where it wasn't already installed. Clearly crooks can do this, it has to be easier when you can sign your downloads and are a 'trusted' vendor.
- joshuamorton 7y ago
  This is some nonsense. > So if you read your corp email on your home computer, or access employee only services from your phone or laptop etc I know literally no Google employees that use Google corp resources from personal computers. Phones are common, but as you're hopefully aware, the security considerations are different. > As for how? It was left unspecified but we speculated they could drop a keylogger or other bit of surveillance kit if you logged into your corporate gmail account from a device where it wasn't already installed. Who theorized this? Because it's certainly not a thing that's ever happened. It would be trivial to detect, either as a client, or by looking at the source of Gmail.

by defen 7y ago

manfredo 7y ago

It's not even an unusual condition. At Dropbox, starting some time in either 2018 or 2019 we had to install a remote administration app on our devices if we wanted to connect to corp vpn or to log into corporate google accounts. Mostly so that the device could be wiped if it was lost, IIRC.

daemin 7y ago
Another reason not to have work email, chat, or any other work system on your personal phone/pc/etc. I think it is a good incentive to disconnect from the workplace.
ethbro 7y ago
Yeah, that's pretty normal for campus network access. Otherwise it kind of defies the logic of having a corporate network in the first place. It's definitely a slippery slope though. "If we already have a privileged app running on people's devices... {insert management-centric ask}"
ryanmercer 7y ago
When I did some contract work for a big crypto exchange, they required you to provide them the ability to remote wipe any device you used, including your personal phone, for their systems. Since they required you to use Authy I just used an old phone with a throwaway gmail account to set Android up and the beat-to-hell Chromebook they provided that would not hold a charge for more than a few minutes.

jcrites 7y ago

The Google policy probably applies to personal devices used in BYOD work settings. Lots of people at tech companies use personal devices for work. This includes things like having your work calendar, email, or corporate applications on your personal phone. In my company's case there is some kind of enterprise iOS policy that gets installed as part of onboarding a device to access company systems. This has the ability to enforce a password policy, monitor installed software and software versions, to lock out devices that are running known vulnerable apps or iOS versions, as well as the technical ability to remotely wipe the entire device (never heard of that being exercised). Company data resides on the device (via email, documents, and other means) so it's reasonable for them to want to have some oversight. An attacker could attempt to get into company systems via the device, after all, since it has (some limited) access to my corporate account. I use my personal phone for work because it's extremely handy to have work email and calendar on my phone, and I don't want to carry two phones.

sjg007 7y ago
Google gives you a phone I think...
oarsinsync 7y ago
> I use my personal phone for work because it's extremely handy to have work email and calendar on my phone, and I don't want to carry two phones. I invite my personal calendar to any work events that I need to be aware of when I'm not at work. Otherwise, when I leave the office, I leave work there too. I'm extremely fortunate to be able to do that. It's tragic that my good fortune isn't an option for many.

dvfjsdhgfv 7y ago

This is quite normal BYOD security policy. If you don't intend to use your personal devices for anything work-related (connecting to the same network, using related accounts) this policy shouldn't apply at all.

throwaway8720 7y ago

I don't think the reply is about BYOD... There is speculation about IMSI catchers being used to target personal cell phones without any BYOD app installed. Didn't a whistleblower at a car company suggest this... https://www.theverge.com/2019/3/13/18263757/tesla-elon-musk-employee-hack-spying-whistleblower-gigafactory-martin-tripp-drugs https://www.theverge.com/2019/3/13/18263757/tesla-elon-musk-... And if such a a company had that technology then we can only speculate its use is more widespread than imagined. Maybe this is the only reason remote jobs are not available at these companies... Nothing to do with being onsite just more of a precaution to vet employees before even allowing them to be remote. So if a company could capture your personal text messages and personal cell phone calls while within an office campus (and no BYOD app installed)... would they use that knowledge to prevent poaching as well? Be careful.

ChuckMcM 7y ago

Not BYOD devices, any device you use to connect to the corporate servers. So if you read your corp email on your home computer, or access employee only services from your phone or laptop etc. One of the interesting things about working there was that much of what you needed to do could be done over the existing Google services. As for how? It was left unspecified but we speculated they could drop a keylogger or other bit of surveillance kit if you logged into your corporate gmail account from a device where it wasn't already installed. Clearly crooks can do this, it has to be easier when you can sign your downloads and are a 'trusted' vendor.

joshuamorton 7y ago
This is some nonsense. > So if you read your corp email on your home computer, or access employee only services from your phone or laptop etc I know literally no Google employees that use Google corp resources from personal computers. Phones are common, but as you're hopefully aware, the security considerations are different. > As for how? It was left unspecified but we speculated they could drop a keylogger or other bit of surveillance kit if you logged into your corporate gmail account from a device where it wasn't already installed. Who theorized this? Because it's certainly not a thing that's ever happened. It would be trivial to detect, either as a client, or by looking at the source of Gmail.