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> All of these plant based milks are overly processed, expensive, and fortified with a bunch of nutrient junk that is lacking. You can make your own very easil

> All of these plant based milks are overly processed, expensive, and fortified with a bunch of nutrient junk that is lacking. You can make your own very easily. Oat milk, for example, requires you to: 1. Put rolled oats into a blender 2. Put water in blender 3. Blend 4. Pour through a strainer into a container 5. Drink up It’s dirt cheap, easy as can be, tastes great, and has no “nutrient junk”. And if you’re so inclined, you can usually buy rolled oats in the bulk bins in most grocery stores, so you can cut out unnecessary packaging too! ETA: Putting a pitted date in for every ~2 cups of water also adds just enough sweetness to mimic the big manufacturers like Oatly and whatnot. Adding coconut flakes and/or cashews can also bump up the fattiness a bit, which is handy for a frothable “barista” style.

bluedino 7y ago
That's also...not milk.
- Spivak 7y ago
  It’s as much milk as turkey bacon is bacon. Food is labeled based on its culinary classification. Something can be culinarily milk without coming out of a teat.
  - naniwaduni 7y ago
    They're not even remotely substitutable. Different plant milks aren't even culinarily substitutable for each other. It's like substituting vinegar for cooking wine: broadly speaking, it'll usually work, but they're really not the same thing. "milk" is more of a visual descriptor than a culinary classification.
    - rootw0rm 7y ago
      I don't know what kind of cooking you do, but in my kitchen substituting vinegar for wine would be considered food-crime.
      - naniwaduni 7y ago
        Oh, absolutely; I'm saying it's not any better to substitute, say, almond milk for cow milk. Worse, even; substituting vinegar for wine won't usually make the whole recipe fall apart altogether the way not enough fat will.
    - Retric 7y ago
      People substituting almond milk for cow milk in cereal is it’s number one use. That’s cooking by the preparing food for consumption definition, even if you don’t use heat that’s hardly required.
    - faemir 7y ago
      Hyperbole much? If they weren't remotely substitutable then why do coffee shops freely offer them as a... substitute. And interchangeably between different plant-based ones at that.
      - jfim 7y ago
        They probably don't work interchangeably in scenarios where the physical characteristics of the milk is a linchpin of the recipe. Baking in general requires precise temperature control and ingredient control (eg. cake, pastry, and bread flour types), whereas adding milk is more of a flavoring that doesn't impact the resulting drink at much (your coffee won't be a chewy inedible mess if you put a different kind of milk).
  - metaphor 7y ago
    > Food is labeled based on its culinary classification. Something can be culinarily milk without coming out of a teat. The FDA[1] would certainly love to hear all about it. [1] https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=165f903bfaa729843acb243ca25ff0e3&mc=true&node=pt21.2.131&rgn=div5 https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=165f903bfaa729843a...
    - jraph 7y ago
      What harm is done by saying plant-based milk? Everybody knows what we are talking about. It is crystal clear (yet white). Milk is still understood by default as cow milk. It will change when and if cow milk is not as widespread as today, and then the word milk will keep reflecting the reality, as today. The FDA, as in many parts of the world (in EU too, for instance), forbids calling such plant-based drinks milk because they are bribed and receive aggressive lobbying from the dairy industry [1]. How are we supposed to call them? Plant-based drinks that are white and look like milk? They are not always used as drinks since they can be used to cook, and are not the only plant based drinks. Yes, this makes it difficult to speak about them. Yes, this is possibly the point, along with avoiding that people think them as alternatives to cow milk. When you are telling people that "this is not milk", you are spreading this lobbying. What is your point? People saying milk for plant based drinks will not be convinced by this prescriptive approach anyway. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/02/10/the-surprisingly-heated-political-battle-raging-over-the-word-milk/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/02/10/the-s...
      - metaphor 7y ago
        > When you are telling people that "this is not milk", you are spreading this lobbying. I neither object to your fallacious assertion, nor find personal shame in supporting its cause if the objective hammer countinues to drop hard on the class of uncritical marketing wank that you've just demonstrated.
      - arcticfox 7y ago
        "Plant-based milk" is actually more deceptive to me as a phrase, given the huge efforts the modern "plant-based meats" go to imitate meat. "Oat milk", "almond milk" etc aren't really making any effort to imitate anything as far as I know, they are what they are.
- AlotOfReading 7y ago
  Plant milks have been called milks for centuries at this point. It's probably okay.
  - swiley 7y ago
    Human breast milk is also called milk but it’s definitely a different thing.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
    - gambiting 7y ago
      Different how? It's definitely no less "milk" than cow's or sheep's or goat's milk. As a substance it's definitely as much "milk" as it can possibly be.
    - t0ddbonzalez 7y ago
      Are you serious? You do know why animals (including humans) produce milk, don't you?
      - swiley 7y ago
        Yes, my point is it tastes very different, I’m not sure I’d want it in my breakfast cereal.
  - metaphor 7y ago
    As nasty and convoluted as they often seem, your remark is a prime example of why I respect the regulations of my country.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
  - gm3dmo 7y ago
    Milk of the Poppy I learned from Game of Thrones.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- Tagbert 7y ago
  “Milk” is used for many kinds of suspension liquids. Milk of Magnesia did not come from a magnesium cow.
  - lostlogin 7y ago
    But it has got a weird system to it. As far as I can tell, a fake “milk” is generally white (or white ish) and it has to be used in situations where milk would usually be used. You don’t get grape milk and or orange milk for example.
    - beatgammit 7y ago
      You probably could if you ground up the seeds and added water, though I'm sure it's not economically practical.
  - metaphor 7y ago
    In the US, the legal description of "milk"[1] is not only regulated but well specified. [1] https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=165f903bfaa729843acb243ca25ff0e3&mc=true&node=pt21.2.131&rgn=div5#se21.2.131_1110 https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=165f903bfaa729843a...
    - everfree 7y ago
      A counterexample to that is that you can walk into any chain supermarket and see "almond milk", "oat milk", and "soy milk" advertised on the shelves. They all use the word "milk", yet none of the manufacturers get in trouble with the FDA. It must be because the code you linked only tells part of the story. I'm guessing that only the word "milk" in isolation is legally required to be from a cow, and that "[blank] milk" (almond, soy, oat, goat, camel) is regulated by different statutes.
      - aaronbrethorst 7y ago
        Not in the EU. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plant_milk#Labeling_and_terminology https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plant_milk#Labeling_and_termin...
p1necone 7y ago
> Putting a pitted date in for every ~2 cups of water also adds just enough sweetness Saw this and had to moan, sorry but this particular trend is a pet peeve of mine. You know dates are sweet because they have sugar in them right? Getting an equivalent amount of sweetness from regular table sugar instead wouldn't be any less healthy, and would be much cheaper and less perishable. I guess you get a bit of dietary fiber and trace amounts of nutrients from a date too, but that doesn't seem relevant when using them as an ingredient with other things.
- iscrewyou 7y ago
  Dates are great in moderation. Everything is. You can say the same thing about bananas or water melons or any melon. Dates have potassium, fiber, and make anything taste great. But dates aren’t the end all fruit for all your nutrient needs. Nutrition facts and moderation is the key.
- dajohnson89 7y ago
  Maybe OP wanted the flavor from dates, as well as the sugar.
- ghostly_s 7y ago
  dates, like other fruit, contain sugar in proportion to dietary fiber which helps moderate intake by making you full. Yes, that effect is probably quite negligible in this application but it's certainly not a harmful rule of thumb to use whole fruits instead of refined sugar where sensible.
- criley2 7y ago
  This is actually pretty bad disinformation considering the overwhelming scientific evidence indicating that eating fruit is great for your diet. A major point is that most fruit isn't sweet enough to dramatically sweeten a product. Most people would over-sweeten their food significantly compared to using fruit. It is in fact difficult to over consume fruit from a sugar perspective, while it is comparatively trivial to over consume sugar from added refined sources. Another benefit to fruit is that instead of being pure sugar like sugar, there are a wide variety of other more complex carbohydrates I'll point out that fruit consumption is inversely correlated with obesity [0] while sugar consumption is positively correlated with it [1] [0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5084020/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5084020/ [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23594708 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23594708 Fruit and vegetable intake is also positively correlated with basically reduction in all cause mortality but specifically heart disease and cancer https://academic.oup.com/ije/article/46/3/1029/3039477 https://academic.oup.com/ije/article/46/3/1029/3039477 There is more to fruit than an overly reductive idea of "sugar + fiber" and there are a lot of compounds in there from vitamins and minerals to other things. The science is clearly showing us that fruit is much more healthy for us than refined sugar, because of a variety of things including how much less sugar there is in most fruit compared to foods with added refined sugars.
2OEH8eoCRo0 7y ago
I'll stick to regular milk that humans have been consuming for millennia. I'm a mammal.
- jackbrookes 7y ago
  Why would you assume drinking milk from a different order of mammal is good for you? And why would you assume that because we have been consuming an item for millennia that it is good for you?
  - 2OEH8eoCRo0 7y ago
    That's literally how you could assume it's good for you but there are also plenty of studies that support the assumption. Plenty show that low-fat or non-fat yogurt and milk are "good" for you. Humans have been milking everything they can get their hands on since prehistoric times. There are a number of reasons to not eat/drink those things (taste, vegan, intolerance, etc) but that doesn't suddenly make yogurt, milk, and cheese "bad" for you. https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/food-features/yogurt/ https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/food-features/y...
  - triceratops 7y ago
    > because we have been consuming an item for millennia that it is good for you? This gives me confidence that it's most probably not fatally bad. Which is good enough for something so delicious as dairy.
- rapunkill 7y ago
  Of all mammals, only humans drink milk into adolescence/adulthood. And only a few of them actually do it regularly.
  - 2OEH8eoCRo0 7y ago
    I'm not sure what that has to do with anything. Of all mammals, only humans ride bicycles. We should stop riding bicycles.

bluedino 7y ago

That's also...not milk.

Spivak 7y ago
It’s as much milk as turkey bacon is bacon. Food is labeled based on its culinary classification. Something can be culinarily milk without coming out of a teat.
- naniwaduni 7y ago
  They're not even remotely substitutable. Different plant milks aren't even culinarily substitutable for each other. It's like substituting vinegar for cooking wine: broadly speaking, it'll usually work, but they're really not the same thing. "milk" is more of a visual descriptor than a culinary classification.
  - rootw0rm 7y ago
    I don't know what kind of cooking you do, but in my kitchen substituting vinegar for wine would be considered food-crime.
    - naniwaduni 7y ago
      Oh, absolutely; I'm saying it's not any better to substitute, say, almond milk for cow milk. Worse, even; substituting vinegar for wine won't usually make the whole recipe fall apart altogether the way not enough fat will.
  - Retric 7y ago
    People substituting almond milk for cow milk in cereal is it’s number one use. That’s cooking by the preparing food for consumption definition, even if you don’t use heat that’s hardly required.
  - faemir 7y ago
    Hyperbole much? If they weren't remotely substitutable then why do coffee shops freely offer them as a... substitute. And interchangeably between different plant-based ones at that.
    - jfim 7y ago
      They probably don't work interchangeably in scenarios where the physical characteristics of the milk is a linchpin of the recipe. Baking in general requires precise temperature control and ingredient control (eg. cake, pastry, and bread flour types), whereas adding milk is more of a flavoring that doesn't impact the resulting drink at much (your coffee won't be a chewy inedible mess if you put a different kind of milk).
- metaphor 7y ago
  > Food is labeled based on its culinary classification. Something can be culinarily milk without coming out of a teat. The FDA[1] would certainly love to hear all about it. [1] https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=165f903bfaa729843acb243ca25ff0e3&mc=true&node=pt21.2.131&rgn=div5 https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=165f903bfaa729843a...
  - jraph 7y ago
    What harm is done by saying plant-based milk? Everybody knows what we are talking about. It is crystal clear (yet white). Milk is still understood by default as cow milk. It will change when and if cow milk is not as widespread as today, and then the word milk will keep reflecting the reality, as today. The FDA, as in many parts of the world (in EU too, for instance), forbids calling such plant-based drinks milk because they are bribed and receive aggressive lobbying from the dairy industry [1]. How are we supposed to call them? Plant-based drinks that are white and look like milk? They are not always used as drinks since they can be used to cook, and are not the only plant based drinks. Yes, this makes it difficult to speak about them. Yes, this is possibly the point, along with avoiding that people think them as alternatives to cow milk. When you are telling people that "this is not milk", you are spreading this lobbying. What is your point? People saying milk for plant based drinks will not be convinced by this prescriptive approach anyway. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/02/10/the-surprisingly-heated-political-battle-raging-over-the-word-milk/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/02/10/the-s...
    - metaphor 7y ago
      > When you are telling people that "this is not milk", you are spreading this lobbying. I neither object to your fallacious assertion, nor find personal shame in supporting its cause if the objective hammer countinues to drop hard on the class of uncritical marketing wank that you've just demonstrated.
    - arcticfox 7y ago
      "Plant-based milk" is actually more deceptive to me as a phrase, given the huge efforts the modern "plant-based meats" go to imitate meat. "Oat milk", "almond milk" etc aren't really making any effort to imitate anything as far as I know, they are what they are.
AlotOfReading 7y ago
Plant milks have been called milks for centuries at this point. It's probably okay.
- swiley 7y ago
  Human breast milk is also called milk but it’s definitely a different thing.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - gambiting 7y ago
    Different how? It's definitely no less "milk" than cow's or sheep's or goat's milk. As a substance it's definitely as much "milk" as it can possibly be.
  - t0ddbonzalez 7y ago
    Are you serious? You do know why animals (including humans) produce milk, don't you?
    - swiley 7y ago
      Yes, my point is it tastes very different, I’m not sure I’d want it in my breakfast cereal.
- metaphor 7y ago
  As nasty and convoluted as they often seem, your remark is a prime example of why I respect the regulations of my country.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- gm3dmo 7y ago
  Milk of the Poppy I learned from Game of Thrones.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
Tagbert 7y ago
“Milk” is used for many kinds of suspension liquids. Milk of Magnesia did not come from a magnesium cow.
- lostlogin 7y ago
  But it has got a weird system to it. As far as I can tell, a fake “milk” is generally white (or white ish) and it has to be used in situations where milk would usually be used. You don’t get grape milk and or orange milk for example.
  - beatgammit 7y ago
    You probably could if you ground up the seeds and added water, though I'm sure it's not economically practical.
- metaphor 7y ago
  In the US, the legal description of "milk"[1] is not only regulated but well specified. [1] https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=165f903bfaa729843acb243ca25ff0e3&mc=true&node=pt21.2.131&rgn=div5#se21.2.131_1110 https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=165f903bfaa729843a...
  - everfree 7y ago
    A counterexample to that is that you can walk into any chain supermarket and see "almond milk", "oat milk", and "soy milk" advertised on the shelves. They all use the word "milk", yet none of the manufacturers get in trouble with the FDA. It must be because the code you linked only tells part of the story. I'm guessing that only the word "milk" in isolation is legally required to be from a cow, and that "[blank] milk" (almond, soy, oat, goat, camel) is regulated by different statutes.
    - aaronbrethorst 7y ago
      Not in the EU. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plant_milk#Labeling_and_terminology https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plant_milk#Labeling_and_termin...

p1necone 7y ago

> Putting a pitted date in for every ~2 cups of water also adds just enough sweetness Saw this and had to moan, sorry but this particular trend is a pet peeve of mine. You know dates are sweet because they have sugar in them right? Getting an equivalent amount of sweetness from regular table sugar instead wouldn't be any less healthy, and would be much cheaper and less perishable. I guess you get a bit of dietary fiber and trace amounts of nutrients from a date too, but that doesn't seem relevant when using them as an ingredient with other things.

iscrewyou 7y ago
Dates are great in moderation. Everything is. You can say the same thing about bananas or water melons or any melon. Dates have potassium, fiber, and make anything taste great. But dates aren’t the end all fruit for all your nutrient needs. Nutrition facts and moderation is the key.
dajohnson89 7y ago
Maybe OP wanted the flavor from dates, as well as the sugar.
ghostly_s 7y ago
dates, like other fruit, contain sugar in proportion to dietary fiber which helps moderate intake by making you full. Yes, that effect is probably quite negligible in this application but it's certainly not a harmful rule of thumb to use whole fruits instead of refined sugar where sensible.
criley2 7y ago
This is actually pretty bad disinformation considering the overwhelming scientific evidence indicating that eating fruit is great for your diet. A major point is that most fruit isn't sweet enough to dramatically sweeten a product. Most people would over-sweeten their food significantly compared to using fruit. It is in fact difficult to over consume fruit from a sugar perspective, while it is comparatively trivial to over consume sugar from added refined sources. Another benefit to fruit is that instead of being pure sugar like sugar, there are a wide variety of other more complex carbohydrates I'll point out that fruit consumption is inversely correlated with obesity [0] while sugar consumption is positively correlated with it [1] [0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5084020/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5084020/ [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23594708 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23594708 Fruit and vegetable intake is also positively correlated with basically reduction in all cause mortality but specifically heart disease and cancer https://academic.oup.com/ije/article/46/3/1029/3039477 https://academic.oup.com/ije/article/46/3/1029/3039477 There is more to fruit than an overly reductive idea of "sugar + fiber" and there are a lot of compounds in there from vitamins and minerals to other things. The science is clearly showing us that fruit is much more healthy for us than refined sugar, because of a variety of things including how much less sugar there is in most fruit compared to foods with added refined sugars.

2OEH8eoCRo0 7y ago

I'll stick to regular milk that humans have been consuming for millennia. I'm a mammal.

jackbrookes 7y ago
Why would you assume drinking milk from a different order of mammal is good for you? And why would you assume that because we have been consuming an item for millennia that it is good for you?
- 2OEH8eoCRo0 7y ago
  That's literally how you could assume it's good for you but there are also plenty of studies that support the assumption. Plenty show that low-fat or non-fat yogurt and milk are "good" for you. Humans have been milking everything they can get their hands on since prehistoric times. There are a number of reasons to not eat/drink those things (taste, vegan, intolerance, etc) but that doesn't suddenly make yogurt, milk, and cheese "bad" for you. https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/food-features/yogurt/ https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/food-features/y...
- triceratops 7y ago
  > because we have been consuming an item for millennia that it is good for you? This gives me confidence that it's most probably not fatally bad. Which is good enough for something so delicious as dairy.
rapunkill 7y ago
Of all mammals, only humans drink milk into adolescence/adulthood. And only a few of them actually do it regularly.
- 2OEH8eoCRo0 7y ago
  I'm not sure what that has to do with anything. Of all mammals, only humans ride bicycles. We should stop riding bicycles.