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One way in which this could (I am being very speculative) be useful is that when we pass a tipping point and most cars are autonomous enough for summoning, this

One way in which this could (I am being very speculative) be useful is that when we pass a tipping point and most cars are autonomous enough for summoning, this could change the architecture of public buildings like malls, condos, and offices: Parking could be deliberately placed far away: Cars could drop you at the front doors, then drive off and park themselves, returning to pick you up when you are done. This could revitalize downtown shopping districts, for example. It may not be a hardship for able people to walk to their car in today’s malls, but perhaps in the future your car could be parked a few kilometers away. That could be a big win for liveability: Imagine malls that didn’t need to be surrounded by acres and acres of asphalt. Shuttles could carry people driving “legacy” vehicles between the parking and the mall, but those with autonomous vehicles wouldn’t need to wait for and share a shuttle.

homonculus1 7y ago
That system isn't getting rid of any asphalt. It's just wasting more time and energy unnecessarily.
- braythwayt 7y ago
  Not true! Acres of asphalt exists because we need to physically park our cars and then walk safely to and from the mall. If we don’t need parking in close proximity, or parking that a human must drive into and walk out of, we can build much more efficient storage for cars than acres of asphalt. They do it in Japan, we just don’t do it in North America.
mrpopo 7y ago
> Parking could be deliberately placed far away: Cars could drop you at the front doors, then drive off and park themselves, returning to pick you up when you are done. > This could revitalize downtown shopping districts, for example. Or we could have that today by limiting car access to downtown shopping districts, having large parking lots outside of town and investing in public transit. This is being enacted and it's working in many middle-sized European cities.
- braythwayt 7y ago
  Well of course, but that’s a different conversation, one in which I’m in agreement with you. Public transit is a win. But as long as people have cars for whatever reason that is outside of my control, cars that can park themselves and then return to pick us up could create less unliveable cities than the ones we have today.
delfinom 7y ago
>This could revitalize downtown shopping districts, for example. Downtown shopping districts already solved this problem...by putting parking lots in the back or shared multi-level parking garages off to the side. Self driving cars aren't magically going to give them money to rebuild if they haven't already.
- braythwayt 7y ago
  In Toronto, parking space within walking distance of shops is expensive. People would rather build condos with it. Being able to park cars five or ten minutes away would make parking more feasible. Of course, we have a crazy thing called public transportation, but our populist Premier hates it.
close04 7y ago
> That could be a big win for liveability Somehow having a lot of traffic created by empty cars is not a win in my liveability book. Unless you're sharing the car and it's picked up by someone 5 minutes away as soon as you get out you earn very little besides some driver convenience. Instead of acting like taxis that you drive yourself, they act like limos and everyone gets to feel like they have a chauffeur to get dropped off exactly at the spot.
- braythwayt 7y ago
  The whole premise of autonomous cars is that they behave like limos. I don’t see how that is any worse than people driving their own cars, I see it as better in many ways, including this. Not as good as people sharing cars, or sharing a Big Urban Service vehicle, we could build it to hold dozens of people... I guess it would be known by the acronym “BUS...”
  - close04 7y ago
    > The whole premise of autonomous cars is that they behave like limos Those would be the fully self driving cars. Cars that can somehow navigate short distances to a parking spot where the next person takes over would be the middle step. They sort of act like a valet service or a "self driven taxi" (comes to you where you need it). > I don’t see how that is any worse A FSD is not worse. Just not better for anyone but the owner unless it's a shared vehicle. The only way we all benefit is if the number of cars goes down because they are shared or people move to more public forms of transport.

homonculus1 7y ago

That system isn't getting rid of any asphalt. It's just wasting more time and energy unnecessarily.

braythwayt 7y ago
Not true! Acres of asphalt exists because we need to physically park our cars and then walk safely to and from the mall. If we don’t need parking in close proximity, or parking that a human must drive into and walk out of, we can build much more efficient storage for cars than acres of asphalt. They do it in Japan, we just don’t do it in North America.

mrpopo 7y ago

> Parking could be deliberately placed far away: Cars could drop you at the front doors, then drive off and park themselves, returning to pick you up when you are done. > This could revitalize downtown shopping districts, for example. Or we could have that today by limiting car access to downtown shopping districts, having large parking lots outside of town and investing in public transit. This is being enacted and it's working in many middle-sized European cities.

braythwayt 7y ago
Well of course, but that’s a different conversation, one in which I’m in agreement with you. Public transit is a win. But as long as people have cars for whatever reason that is outside of my control, cars that can park themselves and then return to pick us up could create less unliveable cities than the ones we have today.

delfinom 7y ago

>This could revitalize downtown shopping districts, for example. Downtown shopping districts already solved this problem...by putting parking lots in the back or shared multi-level parking garages off to the side. Self driving cars aren't magically going to give them money to rebuild if they haven't already.

braythwayt 7y ago
In Toronto, parking space within walking distance of shops is expensive. People would rather build condos with it. Being able to park cars five or ten minutes away would make parking more feasible. Of course, we have a crazy thing called public transportation, but our populist Premier hates it.

close04 7y ago

> That could be a big win for liveability Somehow having a lot of traffic created by empty cars is not a win in my liveability book. Unless you're sharing the car and it's picked up by someone 5 minutes away as soon as you get out you earn very little besides some driver convenience. Instead of acting like taxis that you drive yourself, they act like limos and everyone gets to feel like they have a chauffeur to get dropped off exactly at the spot.

braythwayt 7y ago
The whole premise of autonomous cars is that they behave like limos. I don’t see how that is any worse than people driving their own cars, I see it as better in many ways, including this. Not as good as people sharing cars, or sharing a Big Urban Service vehicle, we could build it to hold dozens of people... I guess it would be known by the acronym “BUS...”
- close04 7y ago
  > The whole premise of autonomous cars is that they behave like limos Those would be the fully self driving cars. Cars that can somehow navigate short distances to a parking spot where the next person takes over would be the middle step. They sort of act like a valet service or a "self driven taxi" (comes to you where you need it). > I don’t see how that is any worse A FSD is not worse. Just not better for anyone but the owner unless it's a shared vehicle. The only way we all benefit is if the number of cars goes down because they are shared or people move to more public forms of transport.