3 ms·

Posted a response to OP, but if you want to hear the pharmacy CEO discuss this testing in depth with Dr. Peter Attia, check out their podcast from a few weeks a

Posted a response to OP, but if you want to hear the pharmacy CEO discuss this testing in depth with Dr. Peter Attia, check out their podcast from a few weeks ago https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-peter-attia-drive/id1400828889?mt=2 https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-peter-attia-drive/... https://peterattiamd.com/davidlight/ https://peterattiamd.com/davidlight/

gus_massa 7y ago
Thanks for the link. Some relevant quotes: > This means you heat the drug up to 130 degrees celsius for 15 minutes [130°C=266°F] That's more temperature than the 80°C in the GP comment. It's common that drugs decompose with temperature. --- > And tested again and found 300,000 nanograms of NDMA in one tablet of Zantac > SGF with 50mM Sodium Nitrite | 3,045 [ng/ml] | 304,500 [ng/tablet] [SGF = simulated gastric fluid, 37°C=98°F, I'd like to see the pH, let's assume 2 or something] The concentration of Sodium Nitrite is weird because it is like x500 bigger than the maximal allowed level in drinking water, and it is also like a hundred times the concentration you'd get from sausages.
- heymijo 7y ago
  You're welcome! This stuff is way outside my area of expertise, but I'm obviously curious what the heck is going on. Glad to see this discussion here on HN.
  - refurb 7y ago
    Thanks for posting the podcast link. As I mentioned earlier, testing pharmaceuticals is not easy. Usually you need to develop a specific method for each drug and then validate it. It’s very easy to actually introduce an impurity (or the appearance of an impurity) with the wrong process. Ranitidine (Zantac) is even more challenging when it comes to NMDA. Most drugs have that impurity from the manufacturing process. Solvents and chemicals react to produce traces of it. Ranitidine has the building blocks of NMDA in the molecule itself. So decomposition of ranitidine will produce NMDA. You could start with 100% pure ranitidine and if you test it wrong, you’ll produce NMDA and be convinced it was in the original material when it wasn’t.
    - heymijo 7y ago
      Appreciate you breaking that down! Really illuminates how complex and challenging chemistry and biology are.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]

gus_massa 7y ago

Thanks for the link. Some relevant quotes: > This means you heat the drug up to 130 degrees celsius for 15 minutes [130°C=266°F] That's more temperature than the 80°C in the GP comment. It's common that drugs decompose with temperature. --- > And tested again and found 300,000 nanograms of NDMA in one tablet of Zantac > SGF with 50mM Sodium Nitrite | 3,045 [ng/ml] | 304,500 [ng/tablet] [SGF = simulated gastric fluid, 37°C=98°F, I'd like to see the pH, let's assume 2 or something] The concentration of Sodium Nitrite is weird because it is like x500 bigger than the maximal allowed level in drinking water, and it is also like a hundred times the concentration you'd get from sausages.

heymijo 7y ago
You're welcome! This stuff is way outside my area of expertise, but I'm obviously curious what the heck is going on. Glad to see this discussion here on HN.
- refurb 7y ago
  Thanks for posting the podcast link. As I mentioned earlier, testing pharmaceuticals is not easy. Usually you need to develop a specific method for each drug and then validate it. It’s very easy to actually introduce an impurity (or the appearance of an impurity) with the wrong process. Ranitidine (Zantac) is even more challenging when it comes to NMDA. Most drugs have that impurity from the manufacturing process. Solvents and chemicals react to produce traces of it. Ranitidine has the building blocks of NMDA in the molecule itself. So decomposition of ranitidine will produce NMDA. You could start with 100% pure ranitidine and if you test it wrong, you’ll produce NMDA and be convinced it was in the original material when it wasn’t.
  - heymijo 7y ago
    Appreciate you breaking that down! Really illuminates how complex and challenging chemistry and biology are.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]