7 ms·

My wife is from Myanmar, where most people only have one name (no first, last, etc.) and has experienced endless frustration since immigrating here to the US. I

My wife is from Myanmar, where most people only have one name (no first, last, etc.) and has experienced endless frustration since immigrating here to the US. It's been quite difficult for her and even limiting in some ways and she's broken down in tears more than once. Some places just put a few letters into each field (like say for the name Jessica, first: Jes, middle: si, last: ca, or something like that). The DMV did that, and then listed her name on her license as <last>\<first> <middle initial>. Others have insisted on putting "nosurname" in the last name field. The immigration people put "FNU" as first name, and her given name in the last. At some places she's put her name twice, once in the first, and once in the last. Not anything close to what she's had to endure, but my name doesn't fit the standard mold either. I prefer to use my middle name and really dislike using my first name (shared whith my dad, who I don't have a good relationship with). I'm endlessly having to explain every single stinking time I interact with pretty much anyone. Anyway, the take away is, please please please (!!!) don't make assumptions about people's names! Ideally just one field labeled "name", and let the user interpret that as they see fit. If you need to collect a legal name then you need to validate it anyway. If you really must do first name / last name then at least make the last optional and also include a field for "what should we call you" or "nick name" or something. Great ted talk about Myanmar names: https://www.ted.com/talks/cynthia_ma_shwe_sin_win_not_good_with_names_local_name_customs_in_a_global_village https://www.ted.com/talks/cynthia_ma_shwe_sin_win_not_good_w...

universenz 7y ago
Just whatever you do don’t put ‘null’ into the fields lol
- HankB99 7y ago
  Or "DROP TABLES"!
thaumasiotes 7y ago
> I prefer to use my middle name and really dislike using my first name (shared with my dad, who I don't have a good relationship with). I'm endlessly having to explain every single stinking time I interact with pretty much anyone. This sounds dramatically overstated. Going by your middle name is normal and doesn't require much in the way of explanations. For example, my father goes by his middle name. This has led to "problems" all of one time -- when he worked for the military, they insisted on the first name. So, during that period, he used the first name.
- packet_nerd 7y ago
  I know it's a minor annoyance, but it's something that jades me every single day and gets really old after a while. I feel companies and websites should do a better job of being respectful. A "what should we call you" field is simple and easy, would make the service much more friendly to some people.
  - krilly 7y ago
    So do you dutifully put your real first name into all forms? I know people who always go by shortened versions of their name (e.g. Rob instead of Robert). They just put in their preferred name as their first name for everything (uni, bills, etc.) You can't blame companies for using the name they give you. Are you worried about being accused of fraud or something?
- mikekchar 7y ago
  It really depends on where. Some places you'll have no trouble and others you will. Whether or not you'll have problems depends on what you want to do. I've have the opposite problem in Japan. Virtually everywhere insists that I use the name on my (Canadian) passport as my official name. It's listed as "Lastname Middlename Firstname". Some government offices can handle 3 names (Yay). Some government offices understand the order for Canadian names and since they often can only handle 2 names, will record my name as "Lastname Firstname" (in Japan, family name comes first). Other offices don't understand the order and assume that my single given name has a space in it. Since they can't handle spaces in their software they list my name as "Lastname Middlename". No amount of explanation will detract them as they have to do it the way they've been told. So now I've got 3 official versions of my name in Japanese official databases (4 if you count the version that is truncated because my name has too many characters). Luckily none of their systems talk to each other ;-) -- though I had one heck of a time getting my "My Number" (similar to social security number) registered because of the confusion. I feel sorry for any Portuguese people (who often have a lot of names) who live in Japan ;-) The situation in the US is not nearly so bad, but I've definitely heard of problems before.
mantap 7y ago
Is there a reason your wife didn't adopt your last name?
- MatthewWilkes 7y ago
  Presumably, if she wanted to change her name to avoid these problems she'd have done that independently. Most people would not want to change their name because of badly programmed systems. Also, many people (and many cultures) consider adopting your husband's surname to be weird.
- packet_nerd 7y ago
  It's not something Burmese women are used to doing, and if you think about it it's kind of a weird holdover from a much more patriarchal time. But, if she'd known how difficult it would be I think she would have anyway.
  - ars 7y ago
    Tons of immigrants at Ellis Island did not have last names, and were assigned them on the spot, or made them up on the spot. Sometimes with humorous results. I imagine it would be extremely difficult to operate in the US without a last name. She doesn't have to adopt yours obviously, but she could pick one. For example Osama Bin Laden. Bin is not his middle name, and Laden is not his last name. It means Osama son of Laden. But his relatives in the US use "BinLaden" as if it were a last name.
    - Piskvorrr 7y ago
      In other words, "I dislike that name, as it doesn't fit the One True Way Of Naming. Here's a Real(tm) name for you." How very nice of you /s Or, as the article says, "39. People whose names break my system are weird outliers. They should have had solid, acceptable names, like 田中太郎."
      - ars 7y ago
        That's like saying, I don't like having an @ symbol in my email address, fix it, make it work the way I like it. Sometimes you just gotta make accommodations to where you live. Having a last name for legal purposes doesn't really change anything about you.
A4ET8a8uTh0 7y ago
That was very informative. Thank you for sharing this ( and useful for my day work ). I know that western naming convention is just that, a convention, but it does help to see how other cultures handled it. Apart from all this, it is always interesting how a given system deals with exceptions.

universenz 7y ago

Just whatever you do don’t put ‘null’ into the fields lol

HankB99 7y ago
Or "DROP TABLES"!

thaumasiotes 7y ago

> I prefer to use my middle name and really dislike using my first name (shared with my dad, who I don't have a good relationship with). I'm endlessly having to explain every single stinking time I interact with pretty much anyone. This sounds dramatically overstated. Going by your middle name is normal and doesn't require much in the way of explanations. For example, my father goes by his middle name. This has led to "problems" all of one time -- when he worked for the military, they insisted on the first name. So, during that period, he used the first name.

packet_nerd 7y ago
I know it's a minor annoyance, but it's something that jades me every single day and gets really old after a while. I feel companies and websites should do a better job of being respectful. A "what should we call you" field is simple and easy, would make the service much more friendly to some people.
- krilly 7y ago
  So do you dutifully put your real first name into all forms? I know people who always go by shortened versions of their name (e.g. Rob instead of Robert). They just put in their preferred name as their first name for everything (uni, bills, etc.) You can't blame companies for using the name they give you. Are you worried about being accused of fraud or something?
mikekchar 7y ago
It really depends on where. Some places you'll have no trouble and others you will. Whether or not you'll have problems depends on what you want to do. I've have the opposite problem in Japan. Virtually everywhere insists that I use the name on my (Canadian) passport as my official name. It's listed as "Lastname Middlename Firstname". Some government offices can handle 3 names (Yay). Some government offices understand the order for Canadian names and since they often can only handle 2 names, will record my name as "Lastname Firstname" (in Japan, family name comes first). Other offices don't understand the order and assume that my single given name has a space in it. Since they can't handle spaces in their software they list my name as "Lastname Middlename". No amount of explanation will detract them as they have to do it the way they've been told. So now I've got 3 official versions of my name in Japanese official databases (4 if you count the version that is truncated because my name has too many characters). Luckily none of their systems talk to each other ;-) -- though I had one heck of a time getting my "My Number" (similar to social security number) registered because of the confusion. I feel sorry for any Portuguese people (who often have a lot of names) who live in Japan ;-) The situation in the US is not nearly so bad, but I've definitely heard of problems before.

mantap 7y ago

Is there a reason your wife didn't adopt your last name?

MatthewWilkes 7y ago
Presumably, if she wanted to change her name to avoid these problems she'd have done that independently. Most people would not want to change their name because of badly programmed systems. Also, many people (and many cultures) consider adopting your husband's surname to be weird.
packet_nerd 7y ago
It's not something Burmese women are used to doing, and if you think about it it's kind of a weird holdover from a much more patriarchal time. But, if she'd known how difficult it would be I think she would have anyway.
- ars 7y ago
  Tons of immigrants at Ellis Island did not have last names, and were assigned them on the spot, or made them up on the spot. Sometimes with humorous results. I imagine it would be extremely difficult to operate in the US without a last name. She doesn't have to adopt yours obviously, but she could pick one. For example Osama Bin Laden. Bin is not his middle name, and Laden is not his last name. It means Osama son of Laden. But his relatives in the US use "BinLaden" as if it were a last name.
  - Piskvorrr 7y ago
    In other words, "I dislike that name, as it doesn't fit the One True Way Of Naming. Here's a Real(tm) name for you." How very nice of you /s Or, as the article says, "39. People whose names break my system are weird outliers. They should have had solid, acceptable names, like 田中太郎."
    - ars 7y ago
      That's like saying, I don't like having an @ symbol in my email address, fix it, make it work the way I like it. Sometimes you just gotta make accommodations to where you live. Having a last name for legal purposes doesn't really change anything about you.

A4ET8a8uTh0 7y ago

That was very informative. Thank you for sharing this ( and useful for my day work ). I know that western naming convention is just that, a convention, but it does help to see how other cultures handled it. Apart from all this, it is always interesting how a given system deals with exceptions.