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A more interesting question is how do you separate narcissism from idealism in a startup founder? I mean it takes a certain type of person to defy the world ag
by OnlineGladiator 7y ago
A more interesting question is how do you separate narcissism from idealism in a startup founder? I mean it takes a certain type of person to defy the world against all odds. Sometimes you end up with someone like Elizabeth Holmes, and sometimes you end up with someone like Yvon Chouinard.
- Spooky23 7y agoThe easiest test is to go out to eat and see how they treat the waitress.
- OnlineGladiator 7y agoI've always considered this the worst possible test. Anyone remotely concerned with their image wouldn't openly treat a waitress poorly in front of company, because they know that company is observing them. If anything, this is the kind of test I'd think a narcissist would propose in order to make themselves look better.
- zozbot234 7y agoIntellectual/social/cultural/artsy etc. curiosity is a very nice test that's not too easy to "fake". Narcissists just don't seem to care that much about the outside world; maybe that also requires a kind of empathy they do not have.
- philwelch 7y agoFor example, consider Steve Jobs. I think you could reasonably describe him as being self-centered, egotistical, and mean. In some ways he superficially resembles many descriptions of narcissism; he even had a similar type of charisma that many successful narcissists share. Except by all accounts, he actually did care passionately about lots of things in the outside world, he cared about music and art and design and beauty. I think fundamentally, rather than being a narcissist, he cared entirely too much about certain things to an unhealthy degree. I don't think it's helpful to lose your temper, but whereas a narcissist will lose his temper when it comes to his own ego, Steve Jobs lost his temper when it came to the world around him not living up to the high standards he was trying to hold everything to. And, not coincidentally, Steve Jobs was a successful startup founder regardless of his personality flaws.
- dboreham 7y ago"superficially" ?? Jobs was a textbook Narcissist.
- zozbot234 7y agoNah. You want an example of a textbook Narcissist? Well, we're all very familiar with one these days. Very different from Steve Jobs, though. Jobs' overt "narcissism" was an act, something he conciously cultivated as part of playing the "game" of creating a successful business. You can see this in many ways if you look carefully.
- OnlineGladiator 7y ago> Jobs' overt "narcissism" was an act, something he conciously cultivated as part of playing the "game" of creating a successful business. You can see this in many ways if you look carefully. Can you please point out some of the many ways he was supposedly manipulating people to run a business better, and how they aren't a byproduct of narcissism?
- dboreham 7y agoIt was an act that he parked in handicapped space every day and never attached a license plate to his car? https://www.cultofmac.com/2613/steve-jobs-still-parking-in-handicapped-spaces-the-pictures/ https://www.cultofmac.com/2613/steve-jobs-still-parking-in-h...