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This. Basically it's the only solid option (imo) that I've seen can help smokers easily quit. I was a smoker for ~10 years and have quit because vaping helped

This. Basically it's the only solid option (imo) that I've seen can help smokers easily quit. I was a smoker for ~10 years and have quit because vaping helped me control and phase out the habit. Marlboro bought juul to kill it, and taint vaping reputation along with, or at least to regulate the F out of it so that only they can continue and kill indie competition.

brokensegue 7y ago
Studies haven't shown vaping to be more effective than other techniques
- ddingus 7y ago
  Soon they will. Great flavored vapes have been taking people off smokes in droves. Source: Newport rep talk over a couple beers. Big tobacco is charting this and can see it big time. They have people all over the place basically identifying premium brand smokers, offering them significant incentives and definitely notice when they are gone. Their most potent, hard to kick, premium bans took a big hit when nicotine salt vape also hit. Juul showed the way. Right now there are tons of smaller players. Big tobacco wants them gone and people on to something more habit forming.
  - brokensegue 7y ago
    many people are doing both tobacco and ecigs which would reduce tobacco sales but not result in cessation of smoking.
    - ddingus 7y ago
      That may be true, but the number of people no longer smoking tobacco is way up, starting about when both nicotine salt and more compelling flavors hit the scene. In general, big tobacco differentiates between less and quit. The quit numbers stand right out. For example, regular smoker gets theirs consistently at store X. Sometimes store X sells to several regular smokers. Gets price break Y to encourage and solidify that behavior. Assuming pack a day numbers, the difference between doing less and people quitting altogether tends to stand out over a bit of time. It's quantized. As to why? I am not convinced flavors had quite the impact nicotine salt did. It's significant though. Some people need something very different from tobacco, and that's where flavors seem to matter. Both seem to need that "hit" where intake of nicotine is competitive with tobacco. Juul actually adds an acid that takes habit forming to a level competitive with tobacco, and that's combined with nicotine salt, which is absorbed more readily than freebase nicotine is. Just nicotine salt, whatever flavor, is almost as potent as what Juul sells. Many cannot tell the difference, or just don't care as it's good enough for them. Typical move is to do both, and the negative experiences from tobacco add up pretty quick. Smell, having to manage flames, ashes, etc... The positives from vaping add up too. Minor league smell, if any, no management of flames, ashes. But, there is charging and the fiddling with various bits. Within a few days, depending on how impacted the smoker is, breathing differences show up, and that seals the deal for impacted smokers. Otherwise, it's just positives outweighing negatives. Cost is a fraction of tobacco, unless one is using Juul at retail. That can be par. Does not have to be. People using juice and their vapor delivery device of choice are going to pay much less.
- whamlastxmas 7y ago
  I've seen studies that show it is.
  - brokensegue 7y ago
    the studies have been mixed to negative for e-cigs being superior to, say, the patch. See https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6546627/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6546627/

brokensegue 7y ago

Studies haven't shown vaping to be more effective than other techniques

ddingus 7y ago
Soon they will. Great flavored vapes have been taking people off smokes in droves. Source: Newport rep talk over a couple beers. Big tobacco is charting this and can see it big time. They have people all over the place basically identifying premium brand smokers, offering them significant incentives and definitely notice when they are gone. Their most potent, hard to kick, premium bans took a big hit when nicotine salt vape also hit. Juul showed the way. Right now there are tons of smaller players. Big tobacco wants them gone and people on to something more habit forming.
- brokensegue 7y ago
  many people are doing both tobacco and ecigs which would reduce tobacco sales but not result in cessation of smoking.
  - ddingus 7y ago
    That may be true, but the number of people no longer smoking tobacco is way up, starting about when both nicotine salt and more compelling flavors hit the scene. In general, big tobacco differentiates between less and quit. The quit numbers stand right out. For example, regular smoker gets theirs consistently at store X. Sometimes store X sells to several regular smokers. Gets price break Y to encourage and solidify that behavior. Assuming pack a day numbers, the difference between doing less and people quitting altogether tends to stand out over a bit of time. It's quantized. As to why? I am not convinced flavors had quite the impact nicotine salt did. It's significant though. Some people need something very different from tobacco, and that's where flavors seem to matter. Both seem to need that "hit" where intake of nicotine is competitive with tobacco. Juul actually adds an acid that takes habit forming to a level competitive with tobacco, and that's combined with nicotine salt, which is absorbed more readily than freebase nicotine is. Just nicotine salt, whatever flavor, is almost as potent as what Juul sells. Many cannot tell the difference, or just don't care as it's good enough for them. Typical move is to do both, and the negative experiences from tobacco add up pretty quick. Smell, having to manage flames, ashes, etc... The positives from vaping add up too. Minor league smell, if any, no management of flames, ashes. But, there is charging and the fiddling with various bits. Within a few days, depending on how impacted the smoker is, breathing differences show up, and that seals the deal for impacted smokers. Otherwise, it's just positives outweighing negatives. Cost is a fraction of tobacco, unless one is using Juul at retail. That can be par. Does not have to be. People using juice and their vapor delivery device of choice are going to pay much less.
whamlastxmas 7y ago
I've seen studies that show it is.
- brokensegue 7y ago
  the studies have been mixed to negative for e-cigs being superior to, say, the patch. See https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6546627/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6546627/