7 ms·

Yes and? Hate speech against white male would be brought down as well.

by Iv 7y ago

Fellshard 7y ago
Let's dive into that: here are tweets made by the accusers leading to Linux Foundation's judgment. https://old.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/dtnamp/linux_foundation_revokes_attendees_registration/f6xvd46/ https://old.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/dtnamp/linux_foundat...
- Iv 7y ago
  Well, have clear rules, clear penalties and due process, saying crap about any skin color is hate speech. You have no shortage of that in the US right now. That's not my country and not much of my business but if half of your country is fine using its free speech defending KKK apologists and the other half only meets that with apathy, don't be surprised if some Black Panthers come back to life and use their own free speech fighting back. And maybe I am less shocked by this affair because in many European cities, wearing a MAGA hat would be seen pretty close as wearing nazi insignia. Under it, lies either someone very racist or someone very confused. And either way probably someone that is not going to have a constructive participation. So yeah, probably lack of clear rules, lack of due process, I hope that's the takeaway they'll get from it. Arbitrary enforcement of vague rules is authoritarianism, but you can have clear rules and due process to limit hate speech. It has been done successfully in several places.
  - Fellshard 7y ago
    I agree with having clear standards. I think the proportions in the US are not quite as dire as you portray.
    - Iv 7y ago
      That's true, he is "just" at 40% of support among voters. He still has won an election in a country that pretends to be democratic, so I'll politely assume he was the choice of the majority.
      - Fellshard 7y ago
        That's a far cry from 'defending KKK apologists'. Then again, having seen other responses you've made in this post, I'm skeptical I should be trying to persuade you.
  - Skaruts 7y ago
    > And maybe I am less shocked by this affair because in many European cities, wearing a MAGA hat would be seen pretty close as wearing nazi insignia. Under it, lies either someone very racist or someone very confused. And either way probably someone that is not going to have a constructive participation. That's what I'd call paranoia. Because the nazi insignia isn't in the least comparable to a MAGA hat. In fact, the nazi insignia is much more comparable to Antifa insignia. Also keep in mind the KKK were democrats.
  - manigandham 7y ago
    What you think MAGA stands for is not what it actually stands for. You're stating all kinds of extremist positions that 99% of people in the US do not hold. Anyone can stir up outrage against a made up situation.
    - Natanael_L 7y ago
      What kind of person would willingly choose to associate themselves with that terminology, without having having such opinions? It's not like it's a secret that it's tied to racists and ultranationalists and other shitty types, especially since the president of yours that introduced it openly supports those people and their use of the term.
      - manigandham 7y ago
        MAGA stands for "make America great again". It's as positive as it gets for terminology. Some extremists carry the American flag. Does that mean someone who flies the American flag as a patriotic symbol are the same? Clearly not, because that would be attributing an extremist position to the majority using the most tenuous of associations. I don't see how that's a productive start for any discussion.
        Natanael_L 7y ago
        Do you actually believe it doesn't carry other connotations which have become universally recognized? Your argument is as naive as pretending to not recognize the swastika's association with nazis. I don't see how it's productive to deliberately ignore how the same president that introduced the term openly supports the violent extremists that use these hats and similar symbols at demonstrations and more. You should know what it symbolizes by now.
        manigandham 7y ago
        No, it doesn't carry other connotations that are universally recognized. The fact that some extremists use it does not override the vast majority, as I described regarding the American flag. The Nazi swastika is not used by anyone else. The majority is the extremists in that case, and they specifically changed the direction and removed the dots from the Asian versions to do so. The president does not support violent extremists, openly or otherwise. "Nazis" are not a real problem anywhere in the modern world.
  - Chris2048 7y ago
    > in many European cities, wearing a MAGA hat would be seen pretty close as wearing nazi insignia Which ones?

Yes and? Hate speech against white male would be brought down as well.

by Iv 7y ago

Yes and? Hate speech against white male would be brought down as well.

Let's dive into that: here are tweets made by the accusers leading to Linux Foundation's judgment. https://old.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/dtnamp/linux_foundation_revokes_attendees_registration/f6xvd46/ https://old.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/dtnamp/linux_foundat...

Iv 7y ago
Well, have clear rules, clear penalties and due process, saying crap about any skin color is hate speech. You have no shortage of that in the US right now. That's not my country and not much of my business but if half of your country is fine using its free speech defending KKK apologists and the other half only meets that with apathy, don't be surprised if some Black Panthers come back to life and use their own free speech fighting back. And maybe I am less shocked by this affair because in many European cities, wearing a MAGA hat would be seen pretty close as wearing nazi insignia. Under it, lies either someone very racist or someone very confused. And either way probably someone that is not going to have a constructive participation. So yeah, probably lack of clear rules, lack of due process, I hope that's the takeaway they'll get from it. Arbitrary enforcement of vague rules is authoritarianism, but you can have clear rules and due process to limit hate speech. It has been done successfully in several places.
- Fellshard 7y ago
  I agree with having clear standards. I think the proportions in the US are not quite as dire as you portray.
  - Iv 7y ago
    That's true, he is "just" at 40% of support among voters. He still has won an election in a country that pretends to be democratic, so I'll politely assume he was the choice of the majority.
    - Fellshard 7y ago
      That's a far cry from 'defending KKK apologists'. Then again, having seen other responses you've made in this post, I'm skeptical I should be trying to persuade you.
- Skaruts 7y ago
  > And maybe I am less shocked by this affair because in many European cities, wearing a MAGA hat would be seen pretty close as wearing nazi insignia. Under it, lies either someone very racist or someone very confused. And either way probably someone that is not going to have a constructive participation. That's what I'd call paranoia. Because the nazi insignia isn't in the least comparable to a MAGA hat. In fact, the nazi insignia is much more comparable to Antifa insignia. Also keep in mind the KKK were democrats.
- manigandham 7y ago
  What you think MAGA stands for is not what it actually stands for. You're stating all kinds of extremist positions that 99% of people in the US do not hold. Anyone can stir up outrage against a made up situation.
  - Natanael_L 7y ago
    What kind of person would willingly choose to associate themselves with that terminology, without having having such opinions? It's not like it's a secret that it's tied to racists and ultranationalists and other shitty types, especially since the president of yours that introduced it openly supports those people and their use of the term.
    - manigandham 7y ago
      MAGA stands for "make America great again". It's as positive as it gets for terminology. Some extremists carry the American flag. Does that mean someone who flies the American flag as a patriotic symbol are the same? Clearly not, because that would be attributing an extremist position to the majority using the most tenuous of associations. I don't see how that's a productive start for any discussion.
      - Natanael_L 7y ago
        Do you actually believe it doesn't carry other connotations which have become universally recognized? Your argument is as naive as pretending to not recognize the swastika's association with nazis. I don't see how it's productive to deliberately ignore how the same president that introduced the term openly supports the violent extremists that use these hats and similar symbols at demonstrations and more. You should know what it symbolizes by now.
        manigandham 7y ago
        No, it doesn't carry other connotations that are universally recognized. The fact that some extremists use it does not override the vast majority, as I described regarding the American flag. The Nazi swastika is not used by anyone else. The majority is the extremists in that case, and they specifically changed the direction and removed the dots from the Asian versions to do so. The president does not support violent extremists, openly or otherwise. "Nazis" are not a real problem anywhere in the modern world.
- Chris2048 7y ago
  > in many European cities, wearing a MAGA hat would be seen pretty close as wearing nazi insignia Which ones?