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AMD appears in a trending section almost every other day. How can OEM's still ignore AMD, I mean. It's obviously very popular. They have the best offering and

AMD appears in a trending section almost every other day. How can OEM's still ignore AMD, I mean. It's obviously very popular. They have the best offering and no one can match their price. How long till Intel's monopoly will fall, because of consumer demand and seemingly (almost) perfect long-term execution of AMD: - 2016 - 8,1% market share - 2019 - 18 % market share According to Intel, they have free game untill 2021. My guess is that they will have free game long after 2023 ( when 3nm architecture will be released by TSMC) I think the market share now is mostly because of DIY builders. Am I wrong? The only serious AMD OEM offering i have seen was from Microsoft's Surface. Side-note: AMD is mostly interesting for desktops for now ( -> battery life), until next Q. But how come OEM desktops lack an AMD alternative? Any articles/information on OEM's partnerships with Intel? PS. Please upvote a more ontopic comment concerning the product itselve. I didn't want this to be the top comment.

nknealk 7y ago
They’re also making headway in the server market. AWS has quite a few AMD powered offerings that have hourly costs lower than intel equivalents https://aws.amazon.com/ec2/amd/ https://aws.amazon.com/ec2/amd/
- NicoJuicy 7y ago
  Yes I know. Azure also and Netflix is considering to change their CPU portfolio :). One of the latest super computers was AMD only. But that is not the OEM market.
bitcoinmoney 7y ago
I have HP elite book with AMd?
privateSFacct 7y ago
My exact question - Lenovo or HP should come out with small business desktop - you cannot buy anything current from either now. Dell never will in their optiplex line I don't think. Rumor has it that Lenovo will do a M75Q machine with AMD. Seeing is believing.
gameswithgo 7y ago
The newest gen ryzens don't have mobile chips yet is one reason. Backroom agreements with Intel is another.
smacktoward 7y ago
> How can OEM's still ignore AMD Intel has been mired in an antitrust action in Europe for a decade now, based on charges that they have engaged in > two types of conduct by Intel vis-à-vis its trading partners, namely conditional rebates and so-called ‘naked restrictions’, intended to exclude a competitor, AMD, from the market for x86 CPUs. The first type of conduct consisted in the grant of rebates to four OEMs, namely Dell, Lenovo, HP and NEC, which were conditioned on these OEMs purchasing all or almost all of their x86 CPUs from Intel. The second type of conduct consisted in making payments to OEMs so that they would delay, cancel or restrict the marketing of certain products equipped with AMD CPUs. (quoted from http://curia.europa.eu/juris/document/document.jsf?text=&docid=194082&pageIndex=0&doclang=EN&mode=lst&dir=&occ=first%26%238706%3B=1&cid=640459 http://curia.europa.eu/juris/document/document.jsf?text=&doc...) This resulted in the levying of a €1bn fine against Intel in 2009, which was sent back to a lower court for review by the Court of Justice of the European Union in 2017. (Not on the grounds that Intel didn't do these things, but that the actions by themselves didn't automatically break the law until someone could demonstrate they actually had anticompetitive effects.)
- p_l 7y ago
  There was also a very visible effect of what is assumed to be deals with large retail chains, where even if the OEMs offered AMD products the retailers wouldn't carry them.
psnosignaluk 7y ago
It's been an interesting year for AMD in the DIY builder space. The every man chip that seems to get recommended at every turn is the 3600X (or 3600 if you're partial to Gamers Nexus). Most of big ticket builds seem to be opting for a 3900X these days. That, however, is a fickle market and subject to the kind of fandom where lines are drawn on brand loyalty that no manner of contrary evidence will shift. As an enthusiast market, let 'em have at it. The saltiness in comment threads can be comedy gold. The day that Intel launches a 12-core + CPU on 10mm, it'll be the belle of the ball for all of the next-gen big ticket builds. Swings and roundabouts. AMD are starting to make some waves in the hyperscale DC with EPYC Rome. The real fun starts if that progress translates into your corporate workhorses starting to opt for EPYC over Xeon in their data centres. Intel are a big company to take down a peg, and have had little motivation to innovate any more than needed. AMD also have a bit of a history of doing amazing things and then dropping the ball in spectacular fashion, which is a candle that no corporate buyer wants to be holding when they've pumped a ton of capex into a 5 year deal pinned on fleet maintenance. Intel might not be dynamic, but at least you know what you're buying into. I think that the same translates to those making the purchasing decisions for corporate users. For enthusiasts, what your machine runs on is a big deal. For everyone else, as long as it switches on and lets you get through a working day without going tits up, who cares? And if it does, it needs to be fixed or replaced before you start falling behind on work. That also trends toward buying patterns that focus on known good config. It's a fun market to watch. If I were back in my old role, I'd be looking for EPYC solutions in my servers and attempting to wrestle a few test laptops with Ryzen 4000 CPU's next year, even if only to worry my boss.
- NicoJuicy 7y ago
  > The day that Intel launches a 12-core + CPU on 10mm, it'll be the belle of the ball for all of the next-gen big ticket builds But it's based on Skylake. I'm not convinced that the game will shift sides that fast. I only mentioned the 3nm becauses it seems a big difference. But i think the architecture is more important and that seems to be a home game for AMD right now.
eyegor 7y ago
Most of the OEM desktops are designed with large contracts far in advance, and AMD has had a fairly poor reputation for the past decade or so thanks to Bulldozer et al. In addition, intels marketing budget is in the neighborhood of amds gross so they can't compete on volume deals. Obv scandals are a thing (see Intel anti trust cases) but I tend to assume it's just a slow moving industry instead of pure shady dealings. Related, AMD's consumer zen 2 chips support ecc, which Intel has always segregated to their enterprise grade parts. Typically ecc is a requirement for the volume business oems (Dell, mostly) so amds new products obliterate any value proposition Intel could even have. Apologies for odd caps, mobile auto correct fights me.
bitL 7y ago
> How can OEM's still ignore AMD, I mean. Most of them got burned very very badly by Opterons. They are likely waiting if this is new AMD or the good old one that cost them millions in the past. Also, AMD has no production capability to displace Intel in any meaningful volume.
- stingraycharles 7y ago
  Out of interest, what happened with the Opterons?
  - spamizbad 7y ago
    Best guess: They were only relevant for like 4 years. As soon as Conroe Xeons hit the scene it was game over.
  - bitL 7y ago
    I've read somewhere (can't find it) that they signed some long-term contracts with OEMs and then cancelled them in the middle (probably to avoid bankruptcy).
bryanlarsen 7y ago
> How can OEM's still ignore AMD? In the last 45 years or so there were many times where Intel's status as king of the hill looked vulnerable: Opteron, Athlon, Cyrix, PowerPC, Motorola 68k, Z80, 6502, ... They've always come back, and anybody who bet against them has been burned badly.
lliamander 7y ago
Intel actually most recently admitted that it will take them until 2023 before they can grow their margins again.

nknealk 7y ago

They’re also making headway in the server market. AWS has quite a few AMD powered offerings that have hourly costs lower than intel equivalents https://aws.amazon.com/ec2/amd/ https://aws.amazon.com/ec2/amd/

NicoJuicy 7y ago
Yes I know. Azure also and Netflix is considering to change their CPU portfolio :). One of the latest super computers was AMD only. But that is not the OEM market.

bitcoinmoney 7y ago

I have HP elite book with AMd?

privateSFacct 7y ago

My exact question - Lenovo or HP should come out with small business desktop - you cannot buy anything current from either now. Dell never will in their optiplex line I don't think. Rumor has it that Lenovo will do a M75Q machine with AMD. Seeing is believing.

gameswithgo 7y ago

The newest gen ryzens don't have mobile chips yet is one reason. Backroom agreements with Intel is another.

smacktoward 7y ago

> How can OEM's still ignore AMD Intel has been mired in an antitrust action in Europe for a decade now, based on charges that they have engaged in > two types of conduct by Intel vis-à-vis its trading partners, namely conditional rebates and so-called ‘naked restrictions’, intended to exclude a competitor, AMD, from the market for x86 CPUs. The first type of conduct consisted in the grant of rebates to four OEMs, namely Dell, Lenovo, HP and NEC, which were conditioned on these OEMs purchasing all or almost all of their x86 CPUs from Intel. The second type of conduct consisted in making payments to OEMs so that they would delay, cancel or restrict the marketing of certain products equipped with AMD CPUs. (quoted from http://curia.europa.eu/juris/document/document.jsf?text=&docid=194082&pageIndex=0&doclang=EN&mode=lst&dir=&occ=first%26%238706%3B=1&cid=640459 http://curia.europa.eu/juris/document/document.jsf?text=&doc...) This resulted in the levying of a €1bn fine against Intel in 2009, which was sent back to a lower court for review by the Court of Justice of the European Union in 2017. (Not on the grounds that Intel didn't do these things, but that the actions by themselves didn't automatically break the law until someone could demonstrate they actually had anticompetitive effects.)

p_l 7y ago
There was also a very visible effect of what is assumed to be deals with large retail chains, where even if the OEMs offered AMD products the retailers wouldn't carry them.

psnosignaluk 7y ago

It's been an interesting year for AMD in the DIY builder space. The every man chip that seems to get recommended at every turn is the 3600X (or 3600 if you're partial to Gamers Nexus). Most of big ticket builds seem to be opting for a 3900X these days. That, however, is a fickle market and subject to the kind of fandom where lines are drawn on brand loyalty that no manner of contrary evidence will shift. As an enthusiast market, let 'em have at it. The saltiness in comment threads can be comedy gold. The day that Intel launches a 12-core + CPU on 10mm, it'll be the belle of the ball for all of the next-gen big ticket builds. Swings and roundabouts. AMD are starting to make some waves in the hyperscale DC with EPYC Rome. The real fun starts if that progress translates into your corporate workhorses starting to opt for EPYC over Xeon in their data centres. Intel are a big company to take down a peg, and have had little motivation to innovate any more than needed. AMD also have a bit of a history of doing amazing things and then dropping the ball in spectacular fashion, which is a candle that no corporate buyer wants to be holding when they've pumped a ton of capex into a 5 year deal pinned on fleet maintenance. Intel might not be dynamic, but at least you know what you're buying into. I think that the same translates to those making the purchasing decisions for corporate users. For enthusiasts, what your machine runs on is a big deal. For everyone else, as long as it switches on and lets you get through a working day without going tits up, who cares? And if it does, it needs to be fixed or replaced before you start falling behind on work. That also trends toward buying patterns that focus on known good config. It's a fun market to watch. If I were back in my old role, I'd be looking for EPYC solutions in my servers and attempting to wrestle a few test laptops with Ryzen 4000 CPU's next year, even if only to worry my boss.

NicoJuicy 7y ago
> The day that Intel launches a 12-core + CPU on 10mm, it'll be the belle of the ball for all of the next-gen big ticket builds But it's based on Skylake. I'm not convinced that the game will shift sides that fast. I only mentioned the 3nm becauses it seems a big difference. But i think the architecture is more important and that seems to be a home game for AMD right now.

eyegor 7y ago

Most of the OEM desktops are designed with large contracts far in advance, and AMD has had a fairly poor reputation for the past decade or so thanks to Bulldozer et al. In addition, intels marketing budget is in the neighborhood of amds gross so they can't compete on volume deals. Obv scandals are a thing (see Intel anti trust cases) but I tend to assume it's just a slow moving industry instead of pure shady dealings. Related, AMD's consumer zen 2 chips support ecc, which Intel has always segregated to their enterprise grade parts. Typically ecc is a requirement for the volume business oems (Dell, mostly) so amds new products obliterate any value proposition Intel could even have. Apologies for odd caps, mobile auto correct fights me.

bitL 7y ago

> How can OEM's still ignore AMD, I mean. Most of them got burned very very badly by Opterons. They are likely waiting if this is new AMD or the good old one that cost them millions in the past. Also, AMD has no production capability to displace Intel in any meaningful volume.

stingraycharles 7y ago
Out of interest, what happened with the Opterons?
- spamizbad 7y ago
  Best guess: They were only relevant for like 4 years. As soon as Conroe Xeons hit the scene it was game over.
- bitL 7y ago
  I've read somewhere (can't find it) that they signed some long-term contracts with OEMs and then cancelled them in the middle (probably to avoid bankruptcy).

bryanlarsen 7y ago

> How can OEM's still ignore AMD? In the last 45 years or so there were many times where Intel's status as king of the hill looked vulnerable: Opteron, Athlon, Cyrix, PowerPC, Motorola 68k, Z80, 6502, ... They've always come back, and anybody who bet against them has been burned badly.

lliamander 7y ago

Intel actually most recently admitted that it will take them until 2023 before they can grow their margins again.