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I'm sorry to go against the grain, but forgive me for not shedding a tear at the impending disappearance of insects and shudders spiders. 1: I am aware of the

I'm sorry to go against the grain, but forgive me for not shedding a tear at the impending disappearance of insects and shudders spiders. 1: I am aware of the importance of insects in the food chain. I know that many animal species, like small birds, feed on insects. I fully accept the consequences. The extinction, or near extinction, of insects is worth the disappearance of some animals. 2: I'm carving an exception for bees. We need bees for pollination (for now).

bdamm 7y ago
What if all wild animals died? Would insect extinction still be worth it?
- HenryKissinger 7y ago
  No, it would not be worth it.
  - hanniabu 7y ago
    Well there's your answer
not_kurt_godel 7y ago
I for one find insects and spiders to be a profoundly beautiful part of our world, and would severely regret their extinction even if it wouldn't be catastrophically consequential for humans (which to be clear, it absolutely would be). Some of my favorite insects/spiders are: dragonflies, butterflies, praying mantises, ants, cicadas, crickets and orb spiders. Appreciating their delicate beauty is an essential part of the human experience.
- xvilka 7y ago
  Not only beautiful, they are worth to study: the knowledge of spider's silk gave us better materials, spiders can fly with the electrostatic fields, Portia spider has a unique 3D-dimensional thinking of usually more complex creatures. And more secrets to discover in the future, I think.
sliken 7y ago
Problem is the food web is complex and not well understood. Just take wolves for instance. Lack of wolves lead to a huge population increase in deer, less trees, less birds, less beavers, more floods, less biodiversity, worse rivers, more erosion, etc. That's just a small sample, there's been several papers published on it if you want to know more. It wasn't until we reintroduced wolves that we had any idea. The bottom of the food tree (plants, plankton, and related) are required for life on earth... even us. You can't just pick bees and let the rest die. There's dangers in larger mono cultures. If we just keep the most productive bees for pollinating our food the diversity will be radically decreased and the parasites, fungus, and diseases will become ever better adapted. Much like what's being fought over the most popular banana, that experts think is doomed because of the huge mono culture and once a fungus becomes adapted will spread through out the supply chain and doom any attempts to raise that same banana. Sure we might be able to add more poison, genetic engineering, and other high tech solutions... at a cost... or maybe we will try and fail. As the load of agriculture on the ecosystem increases very bad results are more likely. Just this week I read something on the use of Neonicotinoids use in rice fields in japan having a huge impact on the fisheries. Apparently getting rid of those pesky non-bees lead to a fishery collapse because there was nothing left for the fish to eat. Said fish weren't eating those non-bees, but the chemicals did impact what they did eat.
obthrowaway 7y ago
Your comment and it's complete lack of knowledge make me understand and feel better about my recent string of comments being down voted for just stating obvious things seen here on HN in the past. There are a lot of hot topics that come up often here and I feel like if you even try to have a supported opposing view you will get downvoted even for stating the obvious in a non confrontational way. I am forced to believe either a bunch of kids moved over from reddit, or that paid shills are actually more common here on HN immediately placing multiple downvotes on views they don't like.
- spraak 7y ago
  The desire for insects and spiders deserve to die is very far from any reasonable viewpoint with contrasting counter points. Unless you're saying that OP is a "reddit kid" I don't see the problem with an irrational idea like this getting downvoted
ouid 7y ago
imagine feeling so entitled that you consider the extinction of a massive part of the ecosystem an acceptable price to allay your irrational fears.
- 3131s 7y ago
  Beyond being entitled, it's possibly the most heinously dumb opinion that I have ever come across. How can someone just not care about the sheer amount of scientific understanding and discovery that would vanish if all insects died?
  - HenryKissinger 7y ago
    You should be more respectful of diverging views. I know that what I said is not politically correct. I am not trying to be edgy. I am truly repulsed by insects and spiders in general. Hence my welcoming of this piece of news. I am just being honest. I could toe the HN line, and express shock and outrage, but that would not be a genuine reflection of what I truly think. I value science, and the scientific discoveries that entomology can bring to the world, but I am perfectly willing to make peace with the near extinction (I don't think even humans could kill all the insects) of something I only have ever had negative experiences with, even at the price of some science. You seem to ignore the fact that mosquitoes are the single most dangerous predator humans have ever known, responsible for billions of deaths, cumulatively, just to name one example. You have the right to think differently, and your opinion is just as legitimate as mine. But don't be surprised if you don't see this news in "BREAKING NEWS" headlines on CNN, ABC, CBS, or in the Wall Street Journal.
Flozzin 7y ago
Could you explain why you don't care?
- HenryKissinger 7y ago
  Too many negative experiences.
  - Flozzin 7y ago
    Thanks for replying. I was hoping for a more in depth explanation though. Insects are such a varied species. Just strikes me as odd that you would hate all insects. Without knowing more, it seems like you may hate cows because you had a rat in your house once... Oh well.
    - HenryKissinger 7y ago
      From a personal point of view, not a biological or a taxological one, there exists more variability in the phenotypes of mammals than insects. So I couldn't possibly apply the generalization I'm making about insects, to mammals.
fiblye 7y ago
And this is what will cause the downfall of our current civilization. With the risk of the total collapse of the bottom links of the food chain and everything that follows, calls to prevent complete disaster will be met with replies of, "no they're icky I don't care."
- HenryKissinger 7y ago
  Yes, the extinction of... mosquitoes ... beetles ... ants ... and butterflies will cause the downfall of our 21st century, techno-industrial, information based civilization. The food chain will be fine. Nature will adapt.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
_Microft 7y ago
From the view of this and your other answers in this subthread, it seems that this is more a problem of yours yourself than one in general. So to be somewhat helpful: if it is an actual phobia that is influencing your life to the negative, you might want to consider talking to a therapist. These revulsions absolutely do not have to influence the rest of your life - there are ways of dealing with phobias (to some degree at least). I am aware that health care recommendations (#) (for US americans, as I assume you are one) can be hit and miss because of the costs involved but I wish you all the best! There's no harm in asking for help if you're in need of it. (#) I am not a doctor, so this is can not to be taken as professional advice/recommendation but rather as something that common sense dictates.
defterGoose 7y ago
You ever played Jenga?

bdamm 7y ago

What if all wild animals died? Would insect extinction still be worth it?

HenryKissinger 7y ago
No, it would not be worth it.
- hanniabu 7y ago
  Well there's your answer

not_kurt_godel 7y ago

I for one find insects and spiders to be a profoundly beautiful part of our world, and would severely regret their extinction even if it wouldn't be catastrophically consequential for humans (which to be clear, it absolutely would be). Some of my favorite insects/spiders are: dragonflies, butterflies, praying mantises, ants, cicadas, crickets and orb spiders. Appreciating their delicate beauty is an essential part of the human experience.

xvilka 7y ago
Not only beautiful, they are worth to study: the knowledge of spider's silk gave us better materials, spiders can fly with the electrostatic fields, Portia spider has a unique 3D-dimensional thinking of usually more complex creatures. And more secrets to discover in the future, I think.

sliken 7y ago

Problem is the food web is complex and not well understood. Just take wolves for instance. Lack of wolves lead to a huge population increase in deer, less trees, less birds, less beavers, more floods, less biodiversity, worse rivers, more erosion, etc. That's just a small sample, there's been several papers published on it if you want to know more. It wasn't until we reintroduced wolves that we had any idea. The bottom of the food tree (plants, plankton, and related) are required for life on earth... even us. You can't just pick bees and let the rest die. There's dangers in larger mono cultures. If we just keep the most productive bees for pollinating our food the diversity will be radically decreased and the parasites, fungus, and diseases will become ever better adapted. Much like what's being fought over the most popular banana, that experts think is doomed because of the huge mono culture and once a fungus becomes adapted will spread through out the supply chain and doom any attempts to raise that same banana. Sure we might be able to add more poison, genetic engineering, and other high tech solutions... at a cost... or maybe we will try and fail. As the load of agriculture on the ecosystem increases very bad results are more likely. Just this week I read something on the use of Neonicotinoids use in rice fields in japan having a huge impact on the fisheries. Apparently getting rid of those pesky non-bees lead to a fishery collapse because there was nothing left for the fish to eat. Said fish weren't eating those non-bees, but the chemicals did impact what they did eat.

obthrowaway 7y ago

Your comment and it's complete lack of knowledge make me understand and feel better about my recent string of comments being down voted for just stating obvious things seen here on HN in the past. There are a lot of hot topics that come up often here and I feel like if you even try to have a supported opposing view you will get downvoted even for stating the obvious in a non confrontational way. I am forced to believe either a bunch of kids moved over from reddit, or that paid shills are actually more common here on HN immediately placing multiple downvotes on views they don't like.

spraak 7y ago
The desire for insects and spiders deserve to die is very far from any reasonable viewpoint with contrasting counter points. Unless you're saying that OP is a "reddit kid" I don't see the problem with an irrational idea like this getting downvoted

ouid 7y ago

imagine feeling so entitled that you consider the extinction of a massive part of the ecosystem an acceptable price to allay your irrational fears.

3131s 7y ago
Beyond being entitled, it's possibly the most heinously dumb opinion that I have ever come across. How can someone just not care about the sheer amount of scientific understanding and discovery that would vanish if all insects died?
- HenryKissinger 7y ago
  You should be more respectful of diverging views. I know that what I said is not politically correct. I am not trying to be edgy. I am truly repulsed by insects and spiders in general. Hence my welcoming of this piece of news. I am just being honest. I could toe the HN line, and express shock and outrage, but that would not be a genuine reflection of what I truly think. I value science, and the scientific discoveries that entomology can bring to the world, but I am perfectly willing to make peace with the near extinction (I don't think even humans could kill all the insects) of something I only have ever had negative experiences with, even at the price of some science. You seem to ignore the fact that mosquitoes are the single most dangerous predator humans have ever known, responsible for billions of deaths, cumulatively, just to name one example. You have the right to think differently, and your opinion is just as legitimate as mine. But don't be surprised if you don't see this news in "BREAKING NEWS" headlines on CNN, ABC, CBS, or in the Wall Street Journal.

Flozzin 7y ago

Could you explain why you don't care?

HenryKissinger 7y ago
Too many negative experiences.
- Flozzin 7y ago
  Thanks for replying. I was hoping for a more in depth explanation though. Insects are such a varied species. Just strikes me as odd that you would hate all insects. Without knowing more, it seems like you may hate cows because you had a rat in your house once... Oh well.
  - HenryKissinger 7y ago
    From a personal point of view, not a biological or a taxological one, there exists more variability in the phenotypes of mammals than insects. So I couldn't possibly apply the generalization I'm making about insects, to mammals.

fiblye 7y ago

And this is what will cause the downfall of our current civilization. With the risk of the total collapse of the bottom links of the food chain and everything that follows, calls to prevent complete disaster will be met with replies of, "no they're icky I don't care."

HenryKissinger 7y ago
Yes, the extinction of... mosquitoes ... beetles ... ants ... and butterflies will cause the downfall of our 21st century, techno-industrial, information based civilization. The food chain will be fine. Nature will adapt.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

_Microft 7y ago

From the view of this and your other answers in this subthread, it seems that this is more a problem of yours yourself than one in general. So to be somewhat helpful: if it is an actual phobia that is influencing your life to the negative, you might want to consider talking to a therapist. These revulsions absolutely do not have to influence the rest of your life - there are ways of dealing with phobias (to some degree at least). I am aware that health care recommendations (#) (for US americans, as I assume you are one) can be hit and miss because of the costs involved but I wish you all the best! There's no harm in asking for help if you're in need of it. (#) I am not a doctor, so this is can not to be taken as professional advice/recommendation but rather as something that common sense dictates.

defterGoose 7y ago

You ever played Jenga?