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Many self learners have no clue about processes, threads, memory allocation. Nor do they care about algorithmic complexity. They end up using a list for a map

Many self learners have no clue about processes, threads, memory allocation. Nor do they care about algorithmic complexity. They end up using a list for a map etc.i.e. there are foundational gaps in their knowledge. A CS program ensures that there is at least an attempt to build a foundation.

jacobolus 7y ago
> Many self learners have no clue about processes, threads, memory allocation. This all also applies to “many CS graduates”. My systems-programmer wife has given up asking basic systems questions to new grads in technical interviews because she just expects to get blank stares at this point. Stuff that was expected knowledge of anyone programming computers in any capacity up through the 1990s is now a mystical secret known only to gurus. Someone who takes hard college courses in operating systems, database implementation, networking, distributed systems, etc. can obviously learn a lot of useful stuff. But those are often not required for a CS degree.
- bdamm 7y ago
  It is possible to scrape through a program without much curiosity or real understanding. Thus defining a clear gap in the workforce that those with CS degrees (and who actually paid attention) can fulfill. Specifically, building the tools, algorithms, and systems that the code monkeys will add features to. Which part of the food chain one wants to show up in has surprisingly little to do with how much one gets paid, but since it doesn't matter, I know where I'd rather be.
- mav3rick 7y ago
  Like I said a CS program at least attempts to bridge this gap. Courses are there. Most self learners are unaware or just want to learn React.
- learc83 7y ago
  If they don't have much worn experience I always look through their transcript.
mbrumlow 7y ago
You can't say that for a fact, and you are probably wrong on that generalization. That same thing that drives people to be good in programming happens with it without schooling. And most of it happens to be experience. You can either pay for experience, or you can get paid to get experience. At the end of the day bad programmers from whatever walks of life are going to use list where maps should be used, and not understand algorithmic complexitie of the code they write. Processes, threads, and memory allocations are all system level operations and a programmers depth of knowledge of them are highly dependent on where in the stack they are working. In fact. I would wager that most self tough programmers are a cut above the average college grad, and way more suited to actually gettng work done. Thry have already shown they are self motivated and don't require hand holding to get the job done. Besides they will also be less stressed from not having all that debt.

jacobolus 7y ago

> Many self learners have no clue about processes, threads, memory allocation. This all also applies to “many CS graduates”. My systems-programmer wife has given up asking basic systems questions to new grads in technical interviews because she just expects to get blank stares at this point. Stuff that was expected knowledge of anyone programming computers in any capacity up through the 1990s is now a mystical secret known only to gurus. Someone who takes hard college courses in operating systems, database implementation, networking, distributed systems, etc. can obviously learn a lot of useful stuff. But those are often not required for a CS degree.

bdamm 7y ago
It is possible to scrape through a program without much curiosity or real understanding. Thus defining a clear gap in the workforce that those with CS degrees (and who actually paid attention) can fulfill. Specifically, building the tools, algorithms, and systems that the code monkeys will add features to. Which part of the food chain one wants to show up in has surprisingly little to do with how much one gets paid, but since it doesn't matter, I know where I'd rather be.
mav3rick 7y ago
Like I said a CS program at least attempts to bridge this gap. Courses are there. Most self learners are unaware or just want to learn React.
learc83 7y ago
If they don't have much worn experience I always look through their transcript.

mbrumlow 7y ago

You can't say that for a fact, and you are probably wrong on that generalization. That same thing that drives people to be good in programming happens with it without schooling. And most of it happens to be experience. You can either pay for experience, or you can get paid to get experience. At the end of the day bad programmers from whatever walks of life are going to use list where maps should be used, and not understand algorithmic complexitie of the code they write. Processes, threads, and memory allocations are all system level operations and a programmers depth of knowledge of them are highly dependent on where in the stack they are working. In fact. I would wager that most self tough programmers are a cut above the average college grad, and way more suited to actually gettng work done. Thry have already shown they are self motivated and don't require hand holding to get the job done. Besides they will also be less stressed from not having all that debt.