30 ms·

No, because I like doing things outside in the summer after 6:30pm.

by as-j 7y ago

fiblye 7y ago
You mean in the sunlight? Because...keeping the clocks moved means that extra hour of sunlight in the evening without blinding light at 4 AM.
- bonzini 7y ago
  It also means no light until 9am in the morning in places where the winter sun would rise at 8. That's depressing, thanks but no thanks. :-)
  - carlmr 7y ago
    But you get that hour in the evening. In the morning you're home and then you go to work or at work (at least for most people), so you don't really even use that hour of sunlight. If you're at work like most people you might not even see it. In the evening you can enjoy that hour and be less depressed.
    - vineyardmike 7y ago
      No you don’t use that hour of sunlight. Some people like it. Personally, my day is so much better when I wake up to the sun vs to cloud/fog/darkness. I just wake up happier, and I have no control over the sun. So no I wouldn’t agree to trade my happiness throughout the day in exchange for eating dinner outside or whatever else people claim they need sunlight for at night.
    - bonzini 7y ago
      No, I don't use that hour in the evening. I work 9-6 and cannot start working earlier because I have to take my son to school and come back home. Sometimes even 9-7 if I take a break to go running or whatever (which in the winter I must do when the sun is very high). That would be after the sun has set (5pm) even with year-round DST. Then I start cooking dinner. In fact, working from home means that I do not go out at all after the sun has set.
kiba 7y ago
Then just adjust the time you do it instead of forcing everybody to deal with DST.
- tzs 7y ago
  A lot of people in places far enough away from the equator to have significant changes in sunlight hours want the increased daylight hours in summer to happen after work rather than before work, and/or do not want them to happen while they are still asleep or trying to sleep in the morning. Yes, we could leave the clocks alone, and change the clock times at which we do things. We could have businesses open at, say, 9 AM in the winter and 8 AM in the summer. We could have schools start an hour earlier in the summer. People tend to want to arrange their sleep schedule so that they pretty much just prepare for work and/or school after waking and then leave, so that their non-work time is all after work. That way they get their non-work time in one block, instead of split into two smaller blocks with work in between. That means we'd be changing our wake up times by an hour in the summer to accommodated business/school opening hours. (Which means those who rely on alarm clocks to wake on time would be changing their alarm time...so much for escaping fiddling with clocks!). Much of what we do is tied to our sleep or work schedules, such as when we get hungry and when we need transit. So...we end up with pretty much everything that operates on a regular schedule having a separate winter and summer schedule. Every place we print schedules has to have two schedules that get swapped between summer and winter. Every place that has an alarm or an alert tied to work or sleep needs to have alarm times swapped between summer and winter. Dealing with all that will involve making more changes twice a year--some to things that can be a hassle to change like signage. Or we can just change the clocks--which are designed to be easy to change, and nowadays most of them can even do it automatically.
  - ClumsyPilot 7y ago
    I live in a country with DST, I currently have 3 devices in my house showing incorrect time. On my way to th city centre I came across 2 public clocks, one at a bus stop, one at a metro stop showing incorrect time. I walk into the KFC and time on the checkout counter is wrong. Which part of this mess is "designed to be easy to change"??
coldtea 7y ago
You don't like "doing things outside in the summer after 6:30pm". You like doing things outside in the summer when the sun is at a certain point. You can do that regardless of whether that point is called 5:30pm, 6:30pm, or 7:30pm....
- bonzini 7y ago
  Perhaps he also has to work until 6pm and cannot choose to start one hour earlier. Perhaps he wants to do things outside just before going out for dinner; in some places restaurants do not open before 7:30pm. And so on. Daylight savings time is only useful in a reduced range of latitudes, I grant that. But where it makes sense, it is way worth one hour of sleep once a year.
  - coldtea 7y ago
    >Perhaps he also has to work until 6pm and cannot choose to start one hour earlier. Perhaps he wants to do things outside just before going out for dinner; in some places restaurants do not open before 7:30pm. And so on. If enough people in a country want to do things "when the sun is at a certain point" and that point coincides with a working hour, they can move the 9-5 to 8-4 or whatever. Coordination does not have to correspond to renaming the hours...
    - big_chungus 7y ago
      You can't just move the time at which society operates. The dependency chain of one thing needing to open with another and so on is too complex for a single entity to control.
      - ClumsyPilot 7y ago
        That's exactly what you do by moving the time. He is suggesting we stop foing it the stupid way, and move the workhours themselves. The current system is like dragging the carpet to move a chair sitting on top. Leave the carpet alone and move the fucking chair directly.
throw0101a 7y ago
And the article goes into that: > All the processes happening in our bodies are co-ordinated by our biological clocks, located in our brains and all other organs. The argument in favour of permanent DST is that there would be more light in the evening. While this is true, we can’t change the number of hours of light in the day. More evening light means less morning light. But importantly, it’s the light in the morning that is most important in resetting our biological clocks. [...] The problem is that we live in societies that force us to get up and go to work or school at times that we don’t get to choose. > Chronobiologists, the name given to scientists who study biological timing, call this situation “social jet lag,” when the body clock doesn’t match the social clock. The article is based on physiology and health effects.

No, because I like doing things outside in the summer after 6:30pm.

by as-j 7y ago

No, because I like doing things outside in the summer after 6:30pm.

You mean in the sunlight? Because...keeping the clocks moved means that extra hour of sunlight in the evening without blinding light at 4 AM.

bonzini 7y ago
It also means no light until 9am in the morning in places where the winter sun would rise at 8. That's depressing, thanks but no thanks. :-)
- carlmr 7y ago
  But you get that hour in the evening. In the morning you're home and then you go to work or at work (at least for most people), so you don't really even use that hour of sunlight. If you're at work like most people you might not even see it. In the evening you can enjoy that hour and be less depressed.
  - vineyardmike 7y ago
    No you don’t use that hour of sunlight. Some people like it. Personally, my day is so much better when I wake up to the sun vs to cloud/fog/darkness. I just wake up happier, and I have no control over the sun. So no I wouldn’t agree to trade my happiness throughout the day in exchange for eating dinner outside or whatever else people claim they need sunlight for at night.
  - bonzini 7y ago
    No, I don't use that hour in the evening. I work 9-6 and cannot start working earlier because I have to take my son to school and come back home. Sometimes even 9-7 if I take a break to go running or whatever (which in the winter I must do when the sun is very high). That would be after the sun has set (5pm) even with year-round DST. Then I start cooking dinner. In fact, working from home means that I do not go out at all after the sun has set.

kiba 7y ago

Then just adjust the time you do it instead of forcing everybody to deal with DST.

tzs 7y ago
A lot of people in places far enough away from the equator to have significant changes in sunlight hours want the increased daylight hours in summer to happen after work rather than before work, and/or do not want them to happen while they are still asleep or trying to sleep in the morning. Yes, we could leave the clocks alone, and change the clock times at which we do things. We could have businesses open at, say, 9 AM in the winter and 8 AM in the summer. We could have schools start an hour earlier in the summer. People tend to want to arrange their sleep schedule so that they pretty much just prepare for work and/or school after waking and then leave, so that their non-work time is all after work. That way they get their non-work time in one block, instead of split into two smaller blocks with work in between. That means we'd be changing our wake up times by an hour in the summer to accommodated business/school opening hours. (Which means those who rely on alarm clocks to wake on time would be changing their alarm time...so much for escaping fiddling with clocks!). Much of what we do is tied to our sleep or work schedules, such as when we get hungry and when we need transit. So...we end up with pretty much everything that operates on a regular schedule having a separate winter and summer schedule. Every place we print schedules has to have two schedules that get swapped between summer and winter. Every place that has an alarm or an alert tied to work or sleep needs to have alarm times swapped between summer and winter. Dealing with all that will involve making more changes twice a year--some to things that can be a hassle to change like signage. Or we can just change the clocks--which are designed to be easy to change, and nowadays most of them can even do it automatically.
- ClumsyPilot 7y ago
  I live in a country with DST, I currently have 3 devices in my house showing incorrect time. On my way to th city centre I came across 2 public clocks, one at a bus stop, one at a metro stop showing incorrect time. I walk into the KFC and time on the checkout counter is wrong. Which part of this mess is "designed to be easy to change"??

coldtea 7y ago

You don't like "doing things outside in the summer after 6:30pm". You like doing things outside in the summer when the sun is at a certain point. You can do that regardless of whether that point is called 5:30pm, 6:30pm, or 7:30pm....

bonzini 7y ago
Perhaps he also has to work until 6pm and cannot choose to start one hour earlier. Perhaps he wants to do things outside just before going out for dinner; in some places restaurants do not open before 7:30pm. And so on. Daylight savings time is only useful in a reduced range of latitudes, I grant that. But where it makes sense, it is way worth one hour of sleep once a year.
- coldtea 7y ago
  >Perhaps he also has to work until 6pm and cannot choose to start one hour earlier. Perhaps he wants to do things outside just before going out for dinner; in some places restaurants do not open before 7:30pm. And so on. If enough people in a country want to do things "when the sun is at a certain point" and that point coincides with a working hour, they can move the 9-5 to 8-4 or whatever. Coordination does not have to correspond to renaming the hours...
  - big_chungus 7y ago
    You can't just move the time at which society operates. The dependency chain of one thing needing to open with another and so on is too complex for a single entity to control.
    - ClumsyPilot 7y ago
      That's exactly what you do by moving the time. He is suggesting we stop foing it the stupid way, and move the workhours themselves. The current system is like dragging the carpet to move a chair sitting on top. Leave the carpet alone and move the fucking chair directly.

throw0101a 7y ago

And the article goes into that: > All the processes happening in our bodies are co-ordinated by our biological clocks, located in our brains and all other organs. The argument in favour of permanent DST is that there would be more light in the evening. While this is true, we can’t change the number of hours of light in the day. More evening light means less morning light. But importantly, it’s the light in the morning that is most important in resetting our biological clocks. [...] The problem is that we live in societies that force us to get up and go to work or school at times that we don’t get to choose. > Chronobiologists, the name given to scientists who study biological timing, call this situation “social jet lag,” when the body clock doesn’t match the social clock. The article is based on physiology and health effects.