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I don't know that it's obvious that the people outside of Catalonia should have a say in Catalonia's secession (which would mean it wouldn't matter what the maj

by arijun 7y ago

I don't know that it's obvious that the people outside of Catalonia should have a say in Catalonia's secession (which would mean it wouldn't matter what the majority of Spain wants, just the majority of Catalans) Somewhere else in this thread someone mentioned that 90% the vote in Catalonia was 90% for secession, and included half the population. It seems unlikely to me that of the half that didn't vote, more than 90% are anti-secession. Keep in mind, I don't live anywhere near the area, so I can't get a gut feeling that someone from there might be able to get.

_0ffh 7y ago
It was an illegal, explicitly forbidden referendum that voted 90% for secession. That anyone even bothered to turn up, just to vote "no" is a small miracle. So, yeah, it seems very likely to me that >90% of those who didn't vote at all would have voted against.
- DuskStar 7y ago
  For more than 50% of the population to oppose secession, you'd need a voting turnout of ~90%, and for all the people who had not previously voted before to vote against secession. (50% turnout with 90% for secession -> 45% of voting population voting for secession) Are voter turnouts normally that high in Spain?
  - yiyus 7y ago
    The referendum was totally out of control. I will always condemn the violent response of the police that day, but the referendum was a total nonsense. You can easily find images of boxes left on the street and people "voting" without any control. And the counting (and whole organization) was done by those who wanted independence. You cannot trust those numbers. There were regional elections on December 2017 and the independentist parties put together got 70 seats of 135 (less than the 72 they had before). More recently, in the elections for the national government this April, they only got 22 seats of 48 (some of the independentists refused to participate in Spanish elections after declaring independence, but turnout was still very high, more than 75%). The independentists never talk about these numbers, only the 90%. And I think that, many of them, seriously believe they are the 90%.
kuu 7y ago
> Somewhere else in this thread someone mentioned that 90% the vote in Catalonia was 90% for secession, and included half the population. That's a lie. The current catalonian separatist government got about 50% of the votes from the catalonian people. 90% of secession it's just not true.

by arijun 7y ago

_0ffh 7y ago

It was an illegal, explicitly forbidden referendum that voted 90% for secession. That anyone even bothered to turn up, just to vote "no" is a small miracle. So, yeah, it seems very likely to me that >90% of those who didn't vote at all would have voted against.

DuskStar 7y ago
For more than 50% of the population to oppose secession, you'd need a voting turnout of ~90%, and for all the people who had not previously voted before to vote against secession. (50% turnout with 90% for secession -> 45% of voting population voting for secession) Are voter turnouts normally that high in Spain?
- yiyus 7y ago
  The referendum was totally out of control. I will always condemn the violent response of the police that day, but the referendum was a total nonsense. You can easily find images of boxes left on the street and people "voting" without any control. And the counting (and whole organization) was done by those who wanted independence. You cannot trust those numbers. There were regional elections on December 2017 and the independentist parties put together got 70 seats of 135 (less than the 72 they had before). More recently, in the elections for the national government this April, they only got 22 seats of 48 (some of the independentists refused to participate in Spanish elections after declaring independence, but turnout was still very high, more than 75%). The independentists never talk about these numbers, only the 90%. And I think that, many of them, seriously believe they are the 90%.

kuu 7y ago

> Somewhere else in this thread someone mentioned that 90% the vote in Catalonia was 90% for secession, and included half the population. That's a lie. The current catalonian separatist government got about 50% of the votes from the catalonian people. 90% of secession it's just not true.