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> But to be fair, the current state of gender relations is all men's fault. My current plan is to make sure more males until the age of eighteen, at least, are

> But to be fair, the current state of gender relations is all men's fault. My current plan is to make sure more males until the age of eighteen, at least, are raised and taught by women. Getting more women in the education and childhood development process early will close the critical gap we have in ensuring boys learn (from an actual woman!) the right way to interact with and treat women. When that happens, it won't be mysterious to men when they experience cooperation and authority coming from a feminine perspective. It's about time we stopped having only men raise and teach every generation of men. Women have much to offer here too. EDIT: I suppose English does need an irony mark. I was riffing on "all men's fault", which clearly discounts female involvement in culture and morality.

freehunter 7y ago
What are you talking about? By far most teachers are women, by far. Something like 75% of all teachers are women [1]. If that's your plan, you've already succeeded... we're far from "having only men raise and teach every generation of men". [1] http://cpre.org/sites/default/files/workingpapers/1506_7trendsapril2014.pdf http://cpre.org/sites/default/files/workingpapers/1506_7tren...
tathougies 7y ago
This is a surefire way to result in misogynistic and violent men, which is indeed what we are seeing in the upsurge in mass shootings.
- AnimalMuppet 7y ago
  How does having women involved in raising boys result in mass shootings? Because, without some kind of causal mechanism (or at least data showing a statistically valid link), this sounds like you're just making stuff up.
  - tathougies 7y ago
    The link exists across all primates (and many mammals). Older men teach young males to behave. This is obvious if you know and speak to men about their childhood. All boys want approval from older men and will act out to get it (girls probably want approval from older women, but that's irrelevant). Anyway I'm not going to write up all the evidence in a post because others have already done so. Here is a good news article which links to a acholarly meta analysis: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-proof-is-infather-abs_b_4941353 https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-proof-is-infather-abs_b_4... Also I'm not arguing against female involvement but female only involvement or female dominant involvement. I'm arguing for dedicated parenting by both parents. Women have been raising men since forever and have actually probably had more influence in the past then today. The hand that rocks tge cradle and all. This is great but not a substitute for father's on a societal scale. Men can't substitute for mothers on a societal scale either. But that's not a major issue today the way father absence is. Finally it does not take a very involved reading of history to realize that individual women also utilize male violence for their own ends. Mothers often ignore sons violence or even encourage it to further their own ends. See any mother of medieval or classical kings and princes to realize that women as a class do not share common interests.
    - AnimalMuppet 7y ago
      Ah, I see. So the problem isn't that the schoolteachers are dominantly female. The problem is that the fathers have abdicated as fathers - either through abandonment, divorce, workaholism, or just being absorbed in other things when home. And other men don't step in and fill the gap (relatives, neighbors, coaches, or religious figures). And that circles right back to the article. If men aren't seen as valuable, including as fathers (not just biologically, but in terms of nurture), then more men abandon that role. That leaves more boys growing up with no male role models. That I can buy leading to "misogynistic and violent men", and even to mass shootings.
      - Aloha 7y ago
        Abdicated, or otherwise printed it prohibited from doing that job by changing cultural norms
rpiguy 7y ago
That’s already happened in certain US populations with disastrous consequences.
- TulliusCicero 7y ago
  I think GP is being sarcastic, since overwhelmingly childcare providers and childhood teachers are already women. Which is itself a problem. We need more elementary school teachers and childcare providers who are men, so that kids get the input of both (common) genders, and don't see taking care of kids as "women's work" (which is the inevitable conclusion they'll come to if 90%+ of the people taking care of them are women).
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
jes 7y ago
"It's about time we stopped having only men raise and teach every generation of men. Women have much to offer here too." About 77% of teachers are female. [1] Also, mothers invest an average of 14 hours / week on child care, vs. 8 hours / week for fathers. [2] [1] https://www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2017/08/15/the-nations-teaching-force-is-still-mostly.html https://www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2017/08/15/the-nations-te... [2] https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/06/12/fathers-day-facts/ https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/06/12/fathers-day...
matheusmoreira 7y ago
This has always been the case. The majority of teachers are and have always been women.
- dpark 7y ago
  > The majority of teachers ... have always been women. This is absolutely not true. For thousands of years teachers were almost exclusively male. As were students.
  - shortandsweet 7y ago
    In what country? Have you been to any US public schools in the last 30 years?
    - Noumenon72 7y ago
      Nothing that happened in the last 30 years can contradict the claim "For thousands of years teachers were almost exclusively male". History of the transition from male to female teachers in the US, around the 1840s: http://www.pbs.org/onlyateacher/timeline.html http://www.pbs.org/onlyateacher/timeline.html
  - shortandsweet 7y ago
    About 77 percent of public school teachers were female and 23 percent were male in 2015–16, with a lower percentage of male teachers at the elementary school level (11 percent) than at the secondary school level (36 percent). First hit on the googly
    - dpark 7y ago
      Reread the comment. Nowhere did I make any statement about the current state of gender split among educators in the US (or elsewhere).

freehunter 7y ago

What are you talking about? By far most teachers are women, by far. Something like 75% of all teachers are women [1]. If that's your plan, you've already succeeded... we're far from "having only men raise and teach every generation of men". [1] http://cpre.org/sites/default/files/workingpapers/1506_7trendsapril2014.pdf http://cpre.org/sites/default/files/workingpapers/1506_7tren...

tathougies 7y ago

This is a surefire way to result in misogynistic and violent men, which is indeed what we are seeing in the upsurge in mass shootings.

AnimalMuppet 7y ago
How does having women involved in raising boys result in mass shootings? Because, without some kind of causal mechanism (or at least data showing a statistically valid link), this sounds like you're just making stuff up.
- tathougies 7y ago
  The link exists across all primates (and many mammals). Older men teach young males to behave. This is obvious if you know and speak to men about their childhood. All boys want approval from older men and will act out to get it (girls probably want approval from older women, but that's irrelevant). Anyway I'm not going to write up all the evidence in a post because others have already done so. Here is a good news article which links to a acholarly meta analysis: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-proof-is-infather-abs_b_4941353 https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-proof-is-infather-abs_b_4... Also I'm not arguing against female involvement but female only involvement or female dominant involvement. I'm arguing for dedicated parenting by both parents. Women have been raising men since forever and have actually probably had more influence in the past then today. The hand that rocks tge cradle and all. This is great but not a substitute for father's on a societal scale. Men can't substitute for mothers on a societal scale either. But that's not a major issue today the way father absence is. Finally it does not take a very involved reading of history to realize that individual women also utilize male violence for their own ends. Mothers often ignore sons violence or even encourage it to further their own ends. See any mother of medieval or classical kings and princes to realize that women as a class do not share common interests.
  - AnimalMuppet 7y ago
    Ah, I see. So the problem isn't that the schoolteachers are dominantly female. The problem is that the fathers have abdicated as fathers - either through abandonment, divorce, workaholism, or just being absorbed in other things when home. And other men don't step in and fill the gap (relatives, neighbors, coaches, or religious figures). And that circles right back to the article. If men aren't seen as valuable, including as fathers (not just biologically, but in terms of nurture), then more men abandon that role. That leaves more boys growing up with no male role models. That I can buy leading to "misogynistic and violent men", and even to mass shootings.
    - Aloha 7y ago
      Abdicated, or otherwise printed it prohibited from doing that job by changing cultural norms

rpiguy 7y ago

That’s already happened in certain US populations with disastrous consequences.

TulliusCicero 7y ago
I think GP is being sarcastic, since overwhelmingly childcare providers and childhood teachers are already women. Which is itself a problem. We need more elementary school teachers and childcare providers who are men, so that kids get the input of both (common) genders, and don't see taking care of kids as "women's work" (which is the inevitable conclusion they'll come to if 90%+ of the people taking care of them are women).

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

jes 7y ago

"It's about time we stopped having only men raise and teach every generation of men. Women have much to offer here too." About 77% of teachers are female. [1] Also, mothers invest an average of 14 hours / week on child care, vs. 8 hours / week for fathers. [2] [1] https://www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2017/08/15/the-nations-teaching-force-is-still-mostly.html https://www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2017/08/15/the-nations-te... [2] https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/06/12/fathers-day-facts/ https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/06/12/fathers-day...

matheusmoreira 7y ago

This has always been the case. The majority of teachers are and have always been women.

dpark 7y ago
> The majority of teachers ... have always been women. This is absolutely not true. For thousands of years teachers were almost exclusively male. As were students.
- shortandsweet 7y ago
  In what country? Have you been to any US public schools in the last 30 years?
  - Noumenon72 7y ago
    Nothing that happened in the last 30 years can contradict the claim "For thousands of years teachers were almost exclusively male". History of the transition from male to female teachers in the US, around the 1840s: http://www.pbs.org/onlyateacher/timeline.html http://www.pbs.org/onlyateacher/timeline.html
- shortandsweet 7y ago
  About 77 percent of public school teachers were female and 23 percent were male in 2015–16, with a lower percentage of male teachers at the elementary school level (11 percent) than at the secondary school level (36 percent). First hit on the googly
  - dpark 7y ago
    Reread the comment. Nowhere did I make any statement about the current state of gender split among educators in the US (or elsewhere).