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As a partial defense of the Ivies, a substantial part of their admins are trying to do that, and there are signs of progress: admission at most of them is now "

As a partial defense of the Ivies, a substantial part of their admins are trying to do that, and there are signs of progress: admission at most of them is now "need-blind" and they have fantastic financial aid. The much bigger issue is that a student with rich parents would have gone to a better school, and would have had more "opportunities to shine" as a teen, and would not have to had to worry about food/shelter/health. This does make such a kid more prepared for college. There are no easy solutions to that type of inequality (the rich kid that got in is actually smart and deserving). I like the solution you are proposing, but the two of us are probably somewhat extreme.

mjevans 7y ago
The most fair solution would probably look a lot like what Harry Potter got at Hogwarts. A student dorm (housing), medical care, and proper meals; all provided by the educational institution (which as a whole was in competition with other institutions). In the HP universe that happened to be paid for by the family estate; in our own reality properly caring for and ensuring that everyone is raised to be an outstanding citizen is both a form of civic infrastructure investment and an insurance policy that helps avoid creating criminals and other negatives for society.
- krastanov 7y ago
  But (as I attempted to convey above) the Ivies already provide housing/food/health care for free for students that qualify for the need (if the family income is under a reasonable threshold). The problem is that if you are poor, your statistically inferior K12 education puts you at a disadvantage when applying to college. We need a version of your Harry Potter solution to be for the actual Harry Potter age group (K12 education).
  - mjevans 7y ago
    It's late for clarifying, but I was speaking much more broadly; as in through the entire life of a child. Though thinking of it, a new new deal would also help the parents, and a structured environment that has 'secondary parents' to assist with raising a child to common standards for society would be good for everyone. That'd be more like schooling / social support without bounds, possibly a good use of human resources when automation finally eliminates the drudgery jobs.
- chongli 7y ago
  The only reason Harry got into Hogwarts was because he was born a wizard (likely inherited from his parents). Based on the way he was treated by his peers, I’d argue that he was one of the most privileged students at the school, apart from Malfoy. The only real oppression Harry experienced was the abuse he suffered at the hands of his uncle and aunt. Plenty of rich kids suffer this sort of abuse from relatives. That doesn’t mean they didn’t still have an advantage in college admissions.
  - JumpCrisscross 7y ago
    > Based on the way he was treated by his peers, I’d argue that he was one of the most privileged students at the school Wasn’t he also phenomenally rich in wizard money?
crankylinuxuser 7y ago
> As a partial defense of the Ivies, a substantial part of their admins are trying to do that, and there are signs of progress: admission at most of them is now "need-blind" and they have fantastic financial aid. And it's feel-good. By the time you're at the point of applying, it's too late. The damage was done with bad elementary schooling regarding the fundamentals. The damage was perpetrated during middle school. At-home school projects was just a selector for how much the parents made. The damage was revealed with "You're a bad student", or "You should consider vocational programs".
- krastanov 7y ago
  Isn't this exactly what I wrote above, just in more flowery language?

mjevans 7y ago

The most fair solution would probably look a lot like what Harry Potter got at Hogwarts. A student dorm (housing), medical care, and proper meals; all provided by the educational institution (which as a whole was in competition with other institutions). In the HP universe that happened to be paid for by the family estate; in our own reality properly caring for and ensuring that everyone is raised to be an outstanding citizen is both a form of civic infrastructure investment and an insurance policy that helps avoid creating criminals and other negatives for society.

krastanov 7y ago
But (as I attempted to convey above) the Ivies already provide housing/food/health care for free for students that qualify for the need (if the family income is under a reasonable threshold). The problem is that if you are poor, your statistically inferior K12 education puts you at a disadvantage when applying to college. We need a version of your Harry Potter solution to be for the actual Harry Potter age group (K12 education).
- mjevans 7y ago
  It's late for clarifying, but I was speaking much more broadly; as in through the entire life of a child. Though thinking of it, a new new deal would also help the parents, and a structured environment that has 'secondary parents' to assist with raising a child to common standards for society would be good for everyone. That'd be more like schooling / social support without bounds, possibly a good use of human resources when automation finally eliminates the drudgery jobs.
chongli 7y ago
The only reason Harry got into Hogwarts was because he was born a wizard (likely inherited from his parents). Based on the way he was treated by his peers, I’d argue that he was one of the most privileged students at the school, apart from Malfoy. The only real oppression Harry experienced was the abuse he suffered at the hands of his uncle and aunt. Plenty of rich kids suffer this sort of abuse from relatives. That doesn’t mean they didn’t still have an advantage in college admissions.
- JumpCrisscross 7y ago
  > Based on the way he was treated by his peers, I’d argue that he was one of the most privileged students at the school Wasn’t he also phenomenally rich in wizard money?

crankylinuxuser 7y ago

> As a partial defense of the Ivies, a substantial part of their admins are trying to do that, and there are signs of progress: admission at most of them is now "need-blind" and they have fantastic financial aid. And it's feel-good. By the time you're at the point of applying, it's too late. The damage was done with bad elementary schooling regarding the fundamentals. The damage was perpetrated during middle school. At-home school projects was just a selector for how much the parents made. The damage was revealed with "You're a bad student", or "You should consider vocational programs".

krastanov 7y ago
Isn't this exactly what I wrote above, just in more flowery language?