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Rock climbing has a very long and storied history of climbers living on absolute scraps to get by, just so they can climb more. This persists in the culture to

Rock climbing has a very long and storied history of climbers living on absolute scraps to get by, just so they can climb more. This persists in the culture to this day. Yvonne Chouinard, depicted in the article, was one of those climbers. He tells stories of eating catfood and stealing leftovers from the hotels in Yosemite Valley to survive. While you're right that making money helps people live an easier life more able to do extraordinary things, climbing culture exemplifies those extraordinary things are possible without it. Much of the development of modern climbing was done with almost no money. Read Steve Roper's "Camp 4".

cc81 7y ago
I like Alex Honnold's answer to "Do all rock climbers live in vans?" https://youtu.be/kDUeh8nyLT0?t=159 https://youtu.be/kDUeh8nyLT0?t=159
- bdamm 7y ago
  Close on the timing mark, this one did it for me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDUeh8nyLT0&t=129 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDUeh8nyLT0&t=129
hodgesrm 7y ago
Or google 'dirtbag climbing'. Fred Beckey was one of the masters. I heard a story that he didn't even have an address for much of his life.
- Mikeb85 7y ago
  Funny you mention Fred Beckey. Randomly met the guy once in a backcountry lodge (I'm an avid backpacker, he was on his way to summit a mountain). Anyhow, most of the climbers I've known were more well to do. It's like ski bums vs. skiers.
  - hodgesrm 7y ago
    I never met Fred Beckey but have been reading his Cascade Alpine Guides for a good chunk of my life. It's an amazing series. Even did a few of the routes. :)
- perfect_wave 7y ago
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRfJGmXg4Yg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRfJGmXg4Yg There's a great great movie about him that came out a year ago.
justinator 7y ago
I think the myth of the dirtbagger is a little played out. It makes for great marketing though. Post War America was a time of relative easy living, especially if you were born in America, white, and a man (and were dodging the draft, too!)
- nlfwhulsdhouv 7y ago
  I 100% agree it's played out, and was never totally true in the first place. However, compared to a lot of other sports that are complex and require a significant amount of equipment, climbing culture is a lot more weary of throwing money at the problem. Critically, a lot of serious climbers are willing to trade more money for more time climbing by selecting less-traditional careers or focusing less on corporate ladder-climbing.
  - justinator 7y ago
    I dunno, climbing gear isn't all that expensive and there's not THAT much gear you need - you can fit it all in a backpack, you know. I see it more that adult life is delayed, since there's the opportunity and privilege to delay it. It's kinda rich kids acting like their poor kids, 'cause that's kind of a cool thing to do. Not everyone of course, but those $100,000 tricked out vans don't pay for themselves. Lots of career folk do roll those out on weekends, but some of those are owned by twenty-somethings. In the minority, you see some people scraping by.
    - watwut 7y ago
      > I dunno, climbing gear isn't all that expensive and there's not THAT much gear you need - you can fit it all in a backpack, you know. Wut? Not expensive compared to what exactly? You know climbers are leaving material behind in mountains and trips themselves are expensive? Why would "fit into backpack" be an argument for why something is cheap?
      - perfect_wave 7y ago
        To be honest he's not wrong. I bought my trad rack (widgets that go in cracks and carabiners for them) for around $2,000. Rope, shoes, helmet, harness, backpacks, etc on top of that is probably another $2,000 at most. Camping gear is another ~$1,000. Most of this stuff (aside from the rope) will last for many years. Occasionally I'll lose a cam out climbing which is $50-80 to replace, but only happens a few times a season. Compare this to skiing or mountain biking and you can see how climbing is a vastly cheaper sport.
sharadov 7y ago
Surfing has the same history, they lived on beaches, ate coconuts and fished, or relied on the generosity of locals, when these places were still not "surfing destinations". Everything cool "skateboarding", "snowboarding", "BMX-biking" started with a rag-tag band of individuals, who were scrappy and had pure love for the activity.

cc81 7y ago

I like Alex Honnold's answer to "Do all rock climbers live in vans?" https://youtu.be/kDUeh8nyLT0?t=159 https://youtu.be/kDUeh8nyLT0?t=159

bdamm 7y ago
Close on the timing mark, this one did it for me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDUeh8nyLT0&t=129 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDUeh8nyLT0&t=129

hodgesrm 7y ago

Or google 'dirtbag climbing'. Fred Beckey was one of the masters. I heard a story that he didn't even have an address for much of his life.

Mikeb85 7y ago
Funny you mention Fred Beckey. Randomly met the guy once in a backcountry lodge (I'm an avid backpacker, he was on his way to summit a mountain). Anyhow, most of the climbers I've known were more well to do. It's like ski bums vs. skiers.
- hodgesrm 7y ago
  I never met Fred Beckey but have been reading his Cascade Alpine Guides for a good chunk of my life. It's an amazing series. Even did a few of the routes. :)
perfect_wave 7y ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRfJGmXg4Yg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRfJGmXg4Yg There's a great great movie about him that came out a year ago.

justinator 7y ago

I think the myth of the dirtbagger is a little played out. It makes for great marketing though. Post War America was a time of relative easy living, especially if you were born in America, white, and a man (and were dodging the draft, too!)

nlfwhulsdhouv 7y ago
I 100% agree it's played out, and was never totally true in the first place. However, compared to a lot of other sports that are complex and require a significant amount of equipment, climbing culture is a lot more weary of throwing money at the problem. Critically, a lot of serious climbers are willing to trade more money for more time climbing by selecting less-traditional careers or focusing less on corporate ladder-climbing.
- justinator 7y ago
  I dunno, climbing gear isn't all that expensive and there's not THAT much gear you need - you can fit it all in a backpack, you know. I see it more that adult life is delayed, since there's the opportunity and privilege to delay it. It's kinda rich kids acting like their poor kids, 'cause that's kind of a cool thing to do. Not everyone of course, but those $100,000 tricked out vans don't pay for themselves. Lots of career folk do roll those out on weekends, but some of those are owned by twenty-somethings. In the minority, you see some people scraping by.
  - watwut 7y ago
    > I dunno, climbing gear isn't all that expensive and there's not THAT much gear you need - you can fit it all in a backpack, you know. Wut? Not expensive compared to what exactly? You know climbers are leaving material behind in mountains and trips themselves are expensive? Why would "fit into backpack" be an argument for why something is cheap?
    - perfect_wave 7y ago
      To be honest he's not wrong. I bought my trad rack (widgets that go in cracks and carabiners for them) for around $2,000. Rope, shoes, helmet, harness, backpacks, etc on top of that is probably another $2,000 at most. Camping gear is another ~$1,000. Most of this stuff (aside from the rope) will last for many years. Occasionally I'll lose a cam out climbing which is $50-80 to replace, but only happens a few times a season. Compare this to skiing or mountain biking and you can see how climbing is a vastly cheaper sport.

sharadov 7y ago

Surfing has the same history, they lived on beaches, ate coconuts and fished, or relied on the generosity of locals, when these places were still not "surfing destinations". Everything cool "skateboarding", "snowboarding", "BMX-biking" started with a rag-tag band of individuals, who were scrappy and had pure love for the activity.