6 ms·

> There are places where it's cold, where it rains and snows. Like Amsterdam and Copenhagen? > The good thing about the driverless cars is that they solve the

> There are places where it's cold, where it rains and snows. Like Amsterdam and Copenhagen? > The good thing about the driverless cars is that they solve the parking problems in the cities. They solve the search for parking by humans. But if you want to get the cars out of the city while they aren't used, you practically double the traffic and emissions.

criddell 7y ago
Amsterdam and Copenhagen don't get very cold.
- bogle 7y ago
  The canals freeze. That's sea water, too.
  - criddell 7y ago
    I'm not saying it never gets cold, just that the climate is much warmer than, say, Wisconsin. I grew up in Southwestern Ontario and we had days were school was cancelled due to cold, not snow. They were worried about frostbite on any exposed skin.
todd8 7y ago
No, not like Amsterdam. I love Amsterdam, but I'm so tired of it being used as an example of how we should all be on bikes. It has a very temperate climate. The weather in most of the US isn't as mild and cool as Amsterdam. There are cites in the US with great weather, for example San Diego, Santa Barbara, all of Marine and Sonoma Counties in CA have great weather (sadly it is having wild fire problems right now). I agree that we could be biking in those places more. The US as a whole has climate all over the place, from polar (N. Alaska) to tropical (S. Florida) to a desert. The coldest it has ever been in the Netherlands is -27 °C, but the continental US has gotten down to -57 °C (Alaska has reached -62 °C). The hottest it has ever been in Amsterdam is +41 °C while the US has reached +57 °C. It's true that these are crazy extremes and we can't decide on public policy based solely on rare events, but there are big cities all over the US where it is too cold to bike. Consider: Average Weather: days at or below temperature: City (population) -18 °C 0 °C ----------------- ------ ----- Amsterdam (821 K) none none Minneapolis (422 K) 23 148 Chicago (2716 K) 7 122 Denver (620 K) 7 157 Milwaukee (595 K) 7 126 Detroit (673 K) 4 115 Indianapolis(872 K) 4 104 Rochester (208 K) 4 129 Buffalo (259 K) 3 124 Cleveland (386 K) 3 104 Hartford (123 K) 3 125 It also gets too hot to bike in the US: Average Weather: days at or above 38 °C: City (population) 38 °C ------------------- ----- Amsterdam (821 K) none Phoenix (1626 K) 107 Las Vegas (642 K) 70 Riverside (328 K) 24 Dallas (1341 K) 17 Austin (951 K) 16 Sacramento (502 K) 11 Oklahoma City (644 K) 11 San Antonio (1493 K) 8 Salt Lake City (201 K) 5 Houston (2313 K) 4 Kansas City (489 K) 3 Some very hardy people do bike in the cold. See [1], the worlds longest winter ultra-marathon (running, biking or skiing 1000km, the last 500 miles without support!!!) It might be the hardest race in the world. (There are not very many other races where contestants have had to be evacuated by helicopter because they were being stalked by a pack of wolves.) [1] https://www.iditarodtrailinvitational.com https://www.iditarodtrailinvitational.com
- zjaffee 7y ago
  Minneapolis has some of the highest percentage of Bike Commuters in the US at around 3.5% only falling after Portland at ~6% and San Francisco which is a nudge closer to 4%. The entire west coast has weather at least as favorable to bike commuting as Amsterdam, yet the percentages of people commuting that way are still far lower than Amsterdam simply because the infrastructure isn't there.
  - OrangeMango 7y ago
    People who think nothing of skiing or snowboarding in winter conditions are convinced that biking is impossible in those same conditions. It makes no sense.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
- scj 7y ago
  Another factor to remember is snowfall. Where I live, we push snow to the side on roads, but it tends to stick around and accumulate for months at a time. Adding a secondary* infrastructure around bicycles would be costly. But the big one is that the Netherlands has about half the population of Canada in an area the size of New Brunswick. Obviously they can afford better transport infrastructure than we can. * Where I live, bike lanes become snow banks circa mid-January.
  - bogle 7y ago
    Where they expect annual snow and have segregated bike lanes you simply plough those, too. I've seen this in Sweden in Uppsala. You bike across a hard pack of snow, just like the cars on the roads. The cars need studded snow tires but the bikes are okay without. In the melt when you can have ice patches then studded tires on your bike are possible.

criddell 7y ago

Amsterdam and Copenhagen don't get very cold.

bogle 7y ago
The canals freeze. That's sea water, too.
- criddell 7y ago
  I'm not saying it never gets cold, just that the climate is much warmer than, say, Wisconsin. I grew up in Southwestern Ontario and we had days were school was cancelled due to cold, not snow. They were worried about frostbite on any exposed skin.

todd8 7y ago

No, not like Amsterdam. I love Amsterdam, but I'm so tired of it being used as an example of how we should all be on bikes. It has a very temperate climate. The weather in most of the US isn't as mild and cool as Amsterdam. There are cites in the US with great weather, for example San Diego, Santa Barbara, all of Marine and Sonoma Counties in CA have great weather (sadly it is having wild fire problems right now). I agree that we could be biking in those places more. The US as a whole has climate all over the place, from polar (N. Alaska) to tropical (S. Florida) to a desert. The coldest it has ever been in the Netherlands is -27 °C, but the continental US has gotten down to -57 °C (Alaska has reached -62 °C). The hottest it has ever been in Amsterdam is +41 °C while the US has reached +57 °C. It's true that these are crazy extremes and we can't decide on public policy based solely on rare events, but there are big cities all over the US where it is too cold to bike. Consider: Average Weather: days at or below temperature: City (population) -18 °C 0 °C ----------------- ------ ----- Amsterdam (821 K) none none Minneapolis (422 K) 23 148 Chicago (2716 K) 7 122 Denver (620 K) 7 157 Milwaukee (595 K) 7 126 Detroit (673 K) 4 115 Indianapolis(872 K) 4 104 Rochester (208 K) 4 129 Buffalo (259 K) 3 124 Cleveland (386 K) 3 104 Hartford (123 K) 3 125 It also gets too hot to bike in the US: Average Weather: days at or above 38 °C: City (population) 38 °C ------------------- ----- Amsterdam (821 K) none Phoenix (1626 K) 107 Las Vegas (642 K) 70 Riverside (328 K) 24 Dallas (1341 K) 17 Austin (951 K) 16 Sacramento (502 K) 11 Oklahoma City (644 K) 11 San Antonio (1493 K) 8 Salt Lake City (201 K) 5 Houston (2313 K) 4 Kansas City (489 K) 3 Some very hardy people do bike in the cold. See [1], the worlds longest winter ultra-marathon (running, biking or skiing 1000km, the last 500 miles without support!!!) It might be the hardest race in the world. (There are not very many other races where contestants have had to be evacuated by helicopter because they were being stalked by a pack of wolves.) [1] https://www.iditarodtrailinvitational.com https://www.iditarodtrailinvitational.com

zjaffee 7y ago
Minneapolis has some of the highest percentage of Bike Commuters in the US at around 3.5% only falling after Portland at ~6% and San Francisco which is a nudge closer to 4%. The entire west coast has weather at least as favorable to bike commuting as Amsterdam, yet the percentages of people commuting that way are still far lower than Amsterdam simply because the infrastructure isn't there.
- OrangeMango 7y ago
  People who think nothing of skiing or snowboarding in winter conditions are convinced that biking is impossible in those same conditions. It makes no sense.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
scj 7y ago
Another factor to remember is snowfall. Where I live, we push snow to the side on roads, but it tends to stick around and accumulate for months at a time. Adding a secondary* infrastructure around bicycles would be costly. But the big one is that the Netherlands has about half the population of Canada in an area the size of New Brunswick. Obviously they can afford better transport infrastructure than we can. * Where I live, bike lanes become snow banks circa mid-January.
- bogle 7y ago
  Where they expect annual snow and have segregated bike lanes you simply plough those, too. I've seen this in Sweden in Uppsala. You bike across a hard pack of snow, just like the cars on the roads. The cars need studded snow tires but the bikes are okay without. In the melt when you can have ice patches then studded tires on your bike are possible.