5 ms·
Law firm mistakes number of days in month, files appeal 1 day after deadline
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- jayess 7y agoThis is why I always file the day before the deadline.
- _31 7y agoOff by one errors and issues working with dates. Sounds like writing software to me.
- pontifier 7y agoYeah, I've had the court skip right over my time to respond, with the judge ruling in favor of his previous employer. I have absolutely no faith left in the courts.
- duxup 7y agoWas there a reason to wait until what they thought was the last day?
- qubex 7y agoMaybe opportunity cost? Other deadlines looming closer? Giv8ng less time to the counterparty to counter-sue? Who knows?
- btbuildem 7y agoI know I'm guilty of waiting until the last minute myself -- but could they not file earlier? Why schedule the filing at the last possible moment, why not even a day earlier?
- JauntyHatAngle 7y agoNot an expert, but I would guess it gives them more time to prepare the appeal case?
- semitext 7y agoTypically when you file anything that is going to trigger a new set of due dates for you based on the date of filing, so it is standard practice to file everything the day it is due, or perhaps the day before at most. That being said it is also standard practice to use docketing software to handle calculating due dates, it isn’t the sort of thing you would ever want to handle manually so I wonder how the screw up occurred.
- Causality1 7y agoI'm not a lawyer so I don't understand why you would file it on the last day anyway. If you're appealing wouldn't you want to file just as soon as you're ready? Filing at the last minute doesn't give a bad impression to everyone involved and in doing so harm your case?
- rad_gruchalski 7y agoIt probably depends on knowing your chances for the appeal to stand. If you know the appeal is not going to stand and appeal simply to delay final judgement (penalties, basically), you are going to wait until the last moment.
- dragonwriter 7y ago> If you're appealing wouldn't you want to file just as soon as you're ready? No, because everything starts a timeline for the next thing, and the way you get the most time for the next thing (which you might need as much as you can get) is to do everything possible without penalty to do the current thing as late as possible. Just because you are ready for the current thing doesn't mean you want to sacrifice time on the next thing. There's also interest in not giving your opponent information earlier than necessary in their cycle for things whose timing isn't keyed off your filing.
- mcv 7y agoThis all sounds needlessly adversarial. Maybe the new deadline should be based on the old deadline, rather than the new filing date that's subject to the old deadline.
- throwaway07Ju19 7y agoIIRC a Ronco YC talk where he declared "procrastination is the devil". Except for unusual circumstances, waiting until the last day on a legal matter is unprofessional. I feel like I am misunderstanding this post.
- londons_explore 7y agoSometimes it is legal tactics... Some court cases are cheaper than the money you are earning before the result of the court case ends your business...
- patentatt 7y agoYeah, it’s usually not procrastination when it comes to legal deadlines. It is very common in many practices to purposely file on the deadline for a variety of reasons. Ripe for mistakes.
- gmiller123456 7y agoEven disregarding legal tactics, unless you're actively loosing money waiting on a result, there is little benefit in filing early. Legal research is never really finished. It would really suck to file your appeal, then have someone stumble upon some other argument you should have made.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- ajdlinux 7y agoAny US lawyers know whether the attempted-appellant has a cause of action against his lawyers for professional negligence here?
- gamblor956 7y agoYes, they do. The lawyers can also look forward to a bar association malpractice investigation, though unless this is part of a pattern, the likely disciplinary action will be relatively mild (i.e., no suspension or disbarment).
- erklik 7y agoReading the other comments, it seems that this is a somewhat standard practice to file at the last possible moment? If so, could there be a possible opportunity here for a software that files right before deadline making sure that mistakes like above do not occur?
- BonesJustice 7y agoUnless your software can walk itself down to the courthouse, probably not. Courts are, to be generous, a bit behind the times.
- gamblor956 7y agoMany courts have allowed parties to file documents by email for years and federal courts have their own e-filing docket that (some federal district) courts mandate.
- Grazester 7y agoMany is not all.
- patentatt 7y agoYup, and legal calendaring software is a medium size cottage industry in itself. It’s fairly standard, and that this firm wasn’t using something that automatically and verifiably counts dates and deadlines correctly is ... lackluster.
- jimnotgym 7y agoThis sounds like something I might do. I am sure I am a special kind of 'date dyslexic'. I have very little concept of when things are happening. I refuse to discuss dates without my diary in front of me, because I have no concept of whether the date they gave me is weeks away or months away. If you told me now that I had to get something done by mid-November, that feels like an age away, the fact that I am on holiday for the next week wouldn't cross my mind either. I recently got undone by a calendar which had Sunday at the start of the week, visually speaking...unlike my normal Outlook calendar. It gives me a lot of anxiety, because I have some things I have to do (like authorising payroll, or filing tax returns) on certain days. Is this a real condition, or am I just disorganised?
- mr_toad 7y ago> I recently got undone by a calendar which had Sunday at the start of the week, This used to be quite common. It seems to have fallen out of favour in the last 30 or 40 years.
- mroche 7y agoDo your calendars use a Min-Sun scheme? All of mine (US based) are Sun-Sat.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- gumby 7y agoEuropean calendars are typically Mon-Sun, UK/AUS/US/CA etc typically Sun-Sat. Just as the more-common-in-Europe 24 hour times have been seeping into UK for decades, perhaps you're seeing the Mon-Sun calendar doing the same thing?
- testrun 7y agoAUS is also Mon - Sun
- 7y ago
- rags2riches 7y agoWhy not state the deadline as a date rather than a number of days?
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- riskneutral 7y agoI am sure this happens with lawyers routinely. Usually a deadline will be expressed in number of days from some event, like “90 days from the date of agreement” or something. If it is an important deadline, do not trust your lawyer to do this day count correctly. Ensure all of the assumptions are correct (date and time of events, whether it is business days or calendar days, etc) and triple check the day counts on a calendar yourself.