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That’s why H1Bs need to be bid on, and the generated revenue should go to fund STEM scholarships for US citizens.

by jmpman 7y ago

vsskanth 7y ago
I wonder what the government has done so far with the ACIWA fee paid with every H1B filed. This is in addition to the premium processing fee which enables USCIS to run a budget surplus.
- jmpman 7y ago
  Good question. Still, the ACIWA fees aren’t enough to make US Citizens cheaper than H1Bs. Another side effect is that housing prices would fall dramatically as the H1Bs would no longer be able to afford expensive Bay Area rentals. They would live 4 to an apartment, freeing up housing stock.
  - jogjayr 7y ago
    So H-1B workers are simultaneously: a) are underpaid indentured labor b) singlehandedly responsible for high Bay Area rents (presumably because they make so much money) I'm sorry, I really don't follow any of this logic. How does falling real estate demand and cheaper rent force H-1B folks to live 4 to a room? Isn't it cheaper for everyone in that case?
    - jmpman 7y ago
      Let’s say that an H1B cost $150k today. If a large enough tax was imposed, the companies are still paying $150k, but $75k of that is a tax, and infosys is getting the other $75k, paying the H1B just $50k. Now, a US citizen would have $150K to pay his/her yearly expenses, while the H1B would only have $50k. The H1B wouldn’t be able to afford a $3000 apartment in the bay and would be forced to share a room. That would then drive down demand, reducing housing costs.
      - dmode 7y ago
        I am very confused about your post. Are you saying that an engineer receiving $150k in base pay today, will suddenly work for $75k tomorrow? Are you also suggesting that there will be two class of engineers, one getting paid 75k and another 150k in the same location ?
rubyn00bie 7y ago
That would be quite literally horrible for everyone involved. The price would skyrocket and the market would be completely out of balance... this would then have at least two horrible effects: 1. The top 500 corporations become gatekeepers to citizenship, as they outbid _everyone_ else for the H1-Bs, they then use their stash of H1-Bs to drive the price of wages down for US citizens... E.g. "A doctor wants YOUR job, brah. Are you a doctor? NO. I only pay doctors the TOP SALARY. Take your $[shit wage] or leave it" 2. It would force highly-skilled people who have immigrated here, learned from our best systems, integrated into our communities and live, to be completely, mind-boggling enslaved by their corporate overlords... OR give up the lives and loves they've built, take all the knowledge they've gotten, and GTFO. E.g. "Well if you don't show up 7 days a week for a menial job, FRIEND, it'll effect your review and you could lose citizenship if you lose your job. NO ONE ELSE WILL HIRE YOU." I could not imagine a worse system if I tried.
- jmpman 7y ago
  If the H1Bs are bid up by the Fortune 500 companies, then the US citizens will be cheaper in comparison. It will ensure that the BEST from around the world are given a chance in the US, not entry level IT workers. As for the indentured slave mentality, I’ve seen that today, even in companies where it’s against policy for the H1B to work more than 40 hours a week. As a US Citizen, I can’t imagine a better system. Our underprivileged citizens will be provided a subsidized education and when they graduate, they will be cheaper to employ than the H1Bs.
  - jogjayr 7y ago
    > It will ensure that the BEST from around the world are given a chance in the US There's already a visa for that - it's called the O visa.[1] The H-1B is for specialty occupations.[2] 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O_visa https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O_visa 2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H-1B_visa https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H-1B_visa
    - jmpman 7y ago
      From earlier in the thread, someone pointed out that graduates from elite colleges are also ultimately competing for H1B slots against Infosys type body shop IT people. There’s no reason American citizens can’t perform the body shop type IT work. What’s worse is that when the recession hits, the H1B will still be employed while US citizens will be looking for jobs. The H1B system doesn’t get rid of H1Bs fast enough when the economy tanks. Maybe the bid price should include a multiple that is reindexed each year based upon the US Citizen unemployment in that field. Example - Initial bid is $50k/year. The H1B is hired, and for two years, the employer pays $50k, until in the third year, when the recession hit, and software developer unemployment rises to 8%, then the tax increases to 75k, causing the employer to get rid of their H1B and to hire a US citizen.

That’s why H1Bs need to be bid on, and the generated revenue should go to fund STEM scholarships for US citizens.

by jmpman 7y ago

That’s why H1Bs need to be bid on, and the generated revenue should go to fund STEM scholarships for US citizens.

I wonder what the government has done so far with the ACIWA fee paid with every H1B filed. This is in addition to the premium processing fee which enables USCIS to run a budget surplus.

jmpman 7y ago
Good question. Still, the ACIWA fees aren’t enough to make US Citizens cheaper than H1Bs. Another side effect is that housing prices would fall dramatically as the H1Bs would no longer be able to afford expensive Bay Area rentals. They would live 4 to an apartment, freeing up housing stock.
- jogjayr 7y ago
  So H-1B workers are simultaneously: a) are underpaid indentured labor b) singlehandedly responsible for high Bay Area rents (presumably because they make so much money) I'm sorry, I really don't follow any of this logic. How does falling real estate demand and cheaper rent force H-1B folks to live 4 to a room? Isn't it cheaper for everyone in that case?
  - jmpman 7y ago
    Let’s say that an H1B cost $150k today. If a large enough tax was imposed, the companies are still paying $150k, but $75k of that is a tax, and infosys is getting the other $75k, paying the H1B just $50k. Now, a US citizen would have $150K to pay his/her yearly expenses, while the H1B would only have $50k. The H1B wouldn’t be able to afford a $3000 apartment in the bay and would be forced to share a room. That would then drive down demand, reducing housing costs.
    - dmode 7y ago
      I am very confused about your post. Are you saying that an engineer receiving $150k in base pay today, will suddenly work for $75k tomorrow? Are you also suggesting that there will be two class of engineers, one getting paid 75k and another 150k in the same location ?

rubyn00bie 7y ago

That would be quite literally horrible for everyone involved. The price would skyrocket and the market would be completely out of balance... this would then have at least two horrible effects: 1. The top 500 corporations become gatekeepers to citizenship, as they outbid _everyone_ else for the H1-Bs, they then use their stash of H1-Bs to drive the price of wages down for US citizens... E.g. "A doctor wants YOUR job, brah. Are you a doctor? NO. I only pay doctors the TOP SALARY. Take your $[shit wage] or leave it" 2. It would force highly-skilled people who have immigrated here, learned from our best systems, integrated into our communities and live, to be completely, mind-boggling enslaved by their corporate overlords... OR give up the lives and loves they've built, take all the knowledge they've gotten, and GTFO. E.g. "Well if you don't show up 7 days a week for a menial job, FRIEND, it'll effect your review and you could lose citizenship if you lose your job. NO ONE ELSE WILL HIRE YOU." I could not imagine a worse system if I tried.

jmpman 7y ago
If the H1Bs are bid up by the Fortune 500 companies, then the US citizens will be cheaper in comparison. It will ensure that the BEST from around the world are given a chance in the US, not entry level IT workers. As for the indentured slave mentality, I’ve seen that today, even in companies where it’s against policy for the H1B to work more than 40 hours a week. As a US Citizen, I can’t imagine a better system. Our underprivileged citizens will be provided a subsidized education and when they graduate, they will be cheaper to employ than the H1Bs.
- jogjayr 7y ago
  > It will ensure that the BEST from around the world are given a chance in the US There's already a visa for that - it's called the O visa.[1] The H-1B is for specialty occupations.[2] 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O_visa https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O_visa 2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H-1B_visa https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H-1B_visa
  - jmpman 7y ago
    From earlier in the thread, someone pointed out that graduates from elite colleges are also ultimately competing for H1B slots against Infosys type body shop IT people. There’s no reason American citizens can’t perform the body shop type IT work. What’s worse is that when the recession hits, the H1B will still be employed while US citizens will be looking for jobs. The H1B system doesn’t get rid of H1Bs fast enough when the economy tanks. Maybe the bid price should include a multiple that is reindexed each year based upon the US Citizen unemployment in that field. Example - Initial bid is $50k/year. The H1B is hired, and for two years, the employer pays $50k, until in the third year, when the recession hit, and software developer unemployment rises to 8%, then the tax increases to 75k, causing the employer to get rid of their H1B and to hire a US citizen.