6 ms·

We clearly have different ideas of “worse”.

AnIdiotOnTheNet 7y ago
Yes, and? When it comes to "what OS should I use on my computer", is it your assertion that I should use your definition instead of my own? If so, you're probably a Linux Desktop evangelist.
- officeplant 7y ago
  Thanks for the hourly reminder to praise GNU
- crispinb 7y ago
  They'll do worse - any reason you put forward for not using their fetishised system will be summarily dismissed, regardless of content, and ultimately even your own experience with said fetish will be denounced as a lie.
- stephenr 7y ago
  Ah, when someone questions your assertion, jump to what you perceive as an insult against them. (a) no, I'm not saying everyone should use the same thing, or that my "definition" of worse is more valid than yours. But consider this context: The original linked email is about a list of glaring usability failures in Windows, experienced by someone who should at the very least be very familiar with the product. I commented and asked if it's really any different now, with some of my own perceptions and experiences, to which you replied and confirmed that it's not better, but that you somehow believe the alternatives are worse. This follows on as: (b) no, I'm not a Linux Desktop evangelist. I mean, I'd definitely use it before I use fucking Windows, but I also don't recommend it to people. Servers? Absolutely. Desktops? I honestly don't have recent enough personal experience with it to recommend it. So, somehow you've managed to agree with the premise that Windows is a dumpster fire of usability bullshit, but then also suggested every alternative is worse, and made a baseless claim about both what I believe, and my likelihood of pushing others to adopt the same viewpoint. Great job.
  - AnIdiotOnTheNet 7y ago
    > and made a baseless claim about both what I believe, and my likelihood of pushing others to adopt the same viewpoint. I did not. I said that if you believed your definition of "worse" was a better metric for me to choose my operating system than mine, then you were probably a Linux Desktop evangelist. A claim I make in full confidence because I've been having to put up with Linux Desktop evangelism for 20 motherfucking years now.
NicoJuicy 7y ago
Perhaps with you, but looking at the market share he is mostly right.
- computerex 7y ago
  To be fair, the market share being dominated by Windows has a lot to do with history and strategic deals Microsoft made with the OEM's. Vast majority of devices ship with Windows.
  - AnIdiotOnTheNet 7y ago
    ...and Macs being expensive and Linux Desktop being an incoherent mess. Literally couldn't even beat Windows by giving the latter away.
    - computerex 7y ago
      I think that's being very unfair. Linux is not the same "incoherent mess" it was 10-20 years ago. There are some OEM's that ship with linux pre-installed, some of them are: - Dell - System76 - Purism > Literally couldn't even beat Windows by giving the latter away. Beat in what sense? That's merely your opinion and doesn't necessarily reflect reality. Especially when you don't support it with any facts. Fact is that the linux story and experience has improved dramatically over the past 10 years. That's why there are now OEM's that provide linux as an alternative to Windows, and there are some OEM's that target linux exclusively. My daily driver is a Dell Latitude E7450 and everything worked out of the box with Manjaro linux. Driver/hardware support in linux these days is quite good.
      - AnIdiotOnTheNet 7y ago
        > Fact is that the linux story and experience has improved dramatically over the past 10 years. Yes, and it still sucks in a lot of the same ways it always has, and a few new ones (bloat, more incomprehensibly tangled base system than ever before...). Just yesterday I watched PCManFM, when told to copy a directory from an SMB share, copy the folder but none of its contents. This kind of basic functionality being completely overlooked is common, because there are about 100 implementations of anything and about 250 different distros combining those things in differently broken ways. Oh, I hear you say, you shouldn't use those obscure distros, but a more polished one like Ubuntu. Only it was Ubuntu 19.04 with the latest updates. This is without even getting into absolutely retarded design decisions like .desktop files.

Yes, and? When it comes to "what OS should I use on my computer", is it your assertion that I should use your definition instead of my own? If so, you're probably a Linux Desktop evangelist.

officeplant 7y ago
Thanks for the hourly reminder to praise GNU
crispinb 7y ago
They'll do worse - any reason you put forward for not using their fetishised system will be summarily dismissed, regardless of content, and ultimately even your own experience with said fetish will be denounced as a lie.
stephenr 7y ago
Ah, when someone questions your assertion, jump to what you perceive as an insult against them. (a) no, I'm not saying everyone should use the same thing, or that my "definition" of worse is more valid than yours. But consider this context: The original linked email is about a list of glaring usability failures in Windows, experienced by someone who should at the very least be very familiar with the product. I commented and asked if it's really any different now, with some of my own perceptions and experiences, to which you replied and confirmed that it's not better, but that you somehow believe the alternatives are worse. This follows on as: (b) no, I'm not a Linux Desktop evangelist. I mean, I'd definitely use it before I use fucking Windows, but I also don't recommend it to people. Servers? Absolutely. Desktops? I honestly don't have recent enough personal experience with it to recommend it. So, somehow you've managed to agree with the premise that Windows is a dumpster fire of usability bullshit, but then also suggested every alternative is worse, and made a baseless claim about both what I believe, and my likelihood of pushing others to adopt the same viewpoint. Great job.
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 7y ago
  > and made a baseless claim about both what I believe, and my likelihood of pushing others to adopt the same viewpoint. I did not. I said that if you believed your definition of "worse" was a better metric for me to choose my operating system than mine, then you were probably a Linux Desktop evangelist. A claim I make in full confidence because I've been having to put up with Linux Desktop evangelism for 20 motherfucking years now.

NicoJuicy 7y ago

Perhaps with you, but looking at the market share he is mostly right.

computerex 7y ago
To be fair, the market share being dominated by Windows has a lot to do with history and strategic deals Microsoft made with the OEM's. Vast majority of devices ship with Windows.
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 7y ago
  ...and Macs being expensive and Linux Desktop being an incoherent mess. Literally couldn't even beat Windows by giving the latter away.
  - computerex 7y ago
    I think that's being very unfair. Linux is not the same "incoherent mess" it was 10-20 years ago. There are some OEM's that ship with linux pre-installed, some of them are: - Dell - System76 - Purism > Literally couldn't even beat Windows by giving the latter away. Beat in what sense? That's merely your opinion and doesn't necessarily reflect reality. Especially when you don't support it with any facts. Fact is that the linux story and experience has improved dramatically over the past 10 years. That's why there are now OEM's that provide linux as an alternative to Windows, and there are some OEM's that target linux exclusively. My daily driver is a Dell Latitude E7450 and everything worked out of the box with Manjaro linux. Driver/hardware support in linux these days is quite good.
    - AnIdiotOnTheNet 7y ago
      > Fact is that the linux story and experience has improved dramatically over the past 10 years. Yes, and it still sucks in a lot of the same ways it always has, and a few new ones (bloat, more incomprehensibly tangled base system than ever before...). Just yesterday I watched PCManFM, when told to copy a directory from an SMB share, copy the folder but none of its contents. This kind of basic functionality being completely overlooked is common, because there are about 100 implementations of anything and about 250 different distros combining those things in differently broken ways. Oh, I hear you say, you shouldn't use those obscure distros, but a more polished one like Ubuntu. Only it was Ubuntu 19.04 with the latest updates. This is without even getting into absolutely retarded design decisions like .desktop files.