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I'm perfectly happy supporting 99.99% of desktop users out there using Linux/Windows/MacOS. Users of BSD, Haiku, Redox and TempleOS are sadly not numerous enoug

I'm perfectly happy supporting 99.99% of desktop users out there using Linux/Windows/MacOS. Users of BSD, Haiku, Redox and TempleOS are sadly not numerous enough to support. It's the same reason any app developer nowadays only supports iOS and Android and not say, KaiOS (honestly, hands up if you've even heard of KaiOS). Don't rag on software teams for making trade-offs based on the resources they have.

inferiorhuman 7y ago
Don't rag on software teams for making trade-offs based on the resources they have. It's not just that app devs aren't making non Linux/x86 apps, the problems are that those devs now cannot make non Linux apps. Period. In spite of this lack of portability they're now crowing about how portable and awesome their "cross-platform" app is. All of this to provide the consistently mediocre Electron experience.
- cweagans 7y ago
  Alternatively, you could roll up your sleeves and add support for whatever obscure OS you want to Electron and then have an entire world of apps available to you. Mediocre and working > not existing
  - inferiorhuman 7y ago
    Alternatively, you could roll up your sleeves and add support for whatever obscure OS you want to Electron and then have an entire world of apps available to you. To what end? The Electron devs have explicitly stated they will reject patches adding support for other platforms. Node is just as bad (letting trivial patches that would fix compilation on FreeBSD just fester). I've already looked at the folks trying to port Electron to FreeBSD and honestly the build system on its own is absolutely horrifying. Qt (even Gtk) is far superior in this regard.
    - cweagans 7y ago
      shrug So maintain it as a third party set of patches. It's not unheard of. For instance, there's a set of Linux patches that improve font rendering. Just because upstream wouldn't accept it doesn't mean that it can't exist. If Qt works for you, use it. Electron works for many people. I don't like Electron apps very much either, but I definitely prefer working Electron apps on Linux than just not having that app available in the first place.
      - inferiorhuman 7y ago
        So maintain it as a third party set of patches. So I can run proprietary apps (because that's what these self-professed app devs are talking about mostly)? Not gonna happen. Just because upstream wouldn't accept it doesn't mean that it can't exist. No, it just means it's a lot of unnecessary work for a framework that already has an arduous build process. I haven't found that killer Electron app just yet so what that means in practical terms is that VS Code goes bye bye when my MacBook Pro finally dies and I move away from Apple (and likely to OpenBSD) on the desktop. I definitely prefer working Electron apps on Linux than just not having that app available in the first place. That's what's known as a false dichotomy. Even if Electron were the only choice, how many of these Electron apps (e.g. Slack, Discord, Signal) would be better off just being used directly from the browser?
        cweagans 7y ago
        > So I can run proprietary apps (because that's what these self-professed app devs are talking about mostly)? Not gonna happen. Well then you don't want it that bad. > I haven't found that killer Electron app just yet so what that means in practical terms is that VS Code goes bye bye when my MacBook Pro finally dies and I move away from Apple (and likely to OpenBSD) on the desktop. You seem to care an awful lot about an issue that doesn't seem to affect you. Why? > That's what's known as a false dichotomy. Even if Electron were the only choice, how many of these Electron apps (e.g. Slack, Discord, Signal) would be better off just being used directly from the browser? I've been using Linux off and on for over a decade now. The single biggest thing that has made it possible for me to use it as my daily driver is that I can continue to get work done without resorting to kludgy workarounds like running everything in a browser. Most companies that I've worked for use Slack enough that not being able to Alt+Tab to it would be a dealbreaker. Even if the only feature that Electron brought was a standalone browser that you could alt+tab, it'd still be worth it. Of course, that's not the case -- allowing for better integration with the desktop is also excellent.

inferiorhuman 7y ago

Don't rag on software teams for making trade-offs based on the resources they have. It's not just that app devs aren't making non Linux/x86 apps, the problems are that those devs now cannot make non Linux apps. Period. In spite of this lack of portability they're now crowing about how portable and awesome their "cross-platform" app is. All of this to provide the consistently mediocre Electron experience.

cweagans 7y ago
Alternatively, you could roll up your sleeves and add support for whatever obscure OS you want to Electron and then have an entire world of apps available to you. Mediocre and working > not existing
- inferiorhuman 7y ago
  Alternatively, you could roll up your sleeves and add support for whatever obscure OS you want to Electron and then have an entire world of apps available to you. To what end? The Electron devs have explicitly stated they will reject patches adding support for other platforms. Node is just as bad (letting trivial patches that would fix compilation on FreeBSD just fester). I've already looked at the folks trying to port Electron to FreeBSD and honestly the build system on its own is absolutely horrifying. Qt (even Gtk) is far superior in this regard.
  - cweagans 7y ago
    shrug So maintain it as a third party set of patches. It's not unheard of. For instance, there's a set of Linux patches that improve font rendering. Just because upstream wouldn't accept it doesn't mean that it can't exist. If Qt works for you, use it. Electron works for many people. I don't like Electron apps very much either, but I definitely prefer working Electron apps on Linux than just not having that app available in the first place.
    - inferiorhuman 7y ago
      So maintain it as a third party set of patches. So I can run proprietary apps (because that's what these self-professed app devs are talking about mostly)? Not gonna happen. Just because upstream wouldn't accept it doesn't mean that it can't exist. No, it just means it's a lot of unnecessary work for a framework that already has an arduous build process. I haven't found that killer Electron app just yet so what that means in practical terms is that VS Code goes bye bye when my MacBook Pro finally dies and I move away from Apple (and likely to OpenBSD) on the desktop. I definitely prefer working Electron apps on Linux than just not having that app available in the first place. That's what's known as a false dichotomy. Even if Electron were the only choice, how many of these Electron apps (e.g. Slack, Discord, Signal) would be better off just being used directly from the browser?
      - cweagans 7y ago
        > So I can run proprietary apps (because that's what these self-professed app devs are talking about mostly)? Not gonna happen. Well then you don't want it that bad. > I haven't found that killer Electron app just yet so what that means in practical terms is that VS Code goes bye bye when my MacBook Pro finally dies and I move away from Apple (and likely to OpenBSD) on the desktop. You seem to care an awful lot about an issue that doesn't seem to affect you. Why? > That's what's known as a false dichotomy. Even if Electron were the only choice, how many of these Electron apps (e.g. Slack, Discord, Signal) would be better off just being used directly from the browser? I've been using Linux off and on for over a decade now. The single biggest thing that has made it possible for me to use it as my daily driver is that I can continue to get work done without resorting to kludgy workarounds like running everything in a browser. Most companies that I've worked for use Slack enough that not being able to Alt+Tab to it would be a dealbreaker. Even if the only feature that Electron brought was a standalone browser that you could alt+tab, it'd still be worth it. Of course, that's not the case -- allowing for better integration with the desktop is also excellent.