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It strikes me as odd that people like yourself don't really get developers. The only reason I'm out of the office is to shake off my tunnel vision and to try to

It strikes me as odd that people like yourself don't really get developers. The only reason I'm out of the office is to shake off my tunnel vision and to try to solve one of the problems I'm working on by changing the environment. I'm out of the office for the refresher and not to blabber about your noisy children or your boring life. "Casual" lunches are super annoying and not productive. Yuck. Thanks god with seniority comes the power to turn people like yourself down without any consequences.

t0mbstone 7y ago
I believe that going to lunch with co-workers should be an opt-in thing, on that we agree. If a company required me to go to lunch with co-workers, then that is technically not a lunch break. That should be considered a "working lunch", and should count towards your hours logged for the week. With that said, I think you are missing out on a key point here, which is that a HUGE part of being an effective programmer within an organization is your ability to communicate and collaborate effectively with other people. When you step out of your comfort zone and spend time building casual relationships with your co-workers, you will discover that your influence within the organization grows, and you will also find that people tend to be more empathetic towards you if (and when) you inevitably screw something up. If someone regards you as a "friend", they are much more likely to extend you some grace when your bugs cause them inconvenience. You will also find that they are more eager to pause what they are working on and stop and help you with things when you need it, or to answer your questions. In a situation where you aren't their friend and they don't stop and help you, you could easily be looking at days/weeks worth of delays and back and forth while they are being unhelpful. Sure, you might be a 10x developer within your little silo, but the moment you need something outside of the silo, you will find those interpersonal relationships can often make a huge difference.
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- rinchik 7y ago
  Please stop throwing around meaningless generalizations and banalities about "silos" and "comfort zones". > Your coworkers with stop helping you because you "didn't go to lunch with them, :sad_face:"! haha that's so silly, so naive, so sentimental! We are not children. And your office is not a playground. We are professional adults in a professional setting. > If someone regards you as a "friend", they are much more likely to extend you some grace Your co-workers are not your friends. Learn the difference, you are not Michael Scott (I hope).
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  - t0mbstone 7y ago
    I prefer to work with professionals who also happen to be my friends (or at least friendly acquaintances who know each other's names). "Professionalism" doesn't have to be an impersonal facade that people hide behind. Work is all about meeting commitments and earning money, sure, but at the end of the day, we are all people, and people have feelings and frustrations. They have things they love and hate. They like being acknowledged and appreciated. This doesn't mean they are children and that the office is a playground free-for-all, though. It just means that your offices are going to be full of people. People who, for better or worse, are often just trying to make ends meet, and are going through the motions at a job they barely stand. I think you would be surprised at what a difference a little empathy, kindness, and friendliness in the workplace can do for a company's success, and also for your own career success (if you try it out). As a side note, one of the things that really opened my eyes to a lot of this was from reading Dale Carnegie's famous book, "How to Win Friends and Influence People". I highly recommend reading it, if you ever get the chance. I might have an extra copy that I would be willing to lend you, if you are curious?
ubercow13 7y ago
In my experience most developers, while often a bit introverted or nerdy, are not particularly different from normal people, who often enjoy social interaction and making friends. I can’t agree with your assertion that real developers are as antisocial as you seem to be.

t0mbstone 7y ago

I believe that going to lunch with co-workers should be an opt-in thing, on that we agree. If a company required me to go to lunch with co-workers, then that is technically not a lunch break. That should be considered a "working lunch", and should count towards your hours logged for the week. With that said, I think you are missing out on a key point here, which is that a HUGE part of being an effective programmer within an organization is your ability to communicate and collaborate effectively with other people. When you step out of your comfort zone and spend time building casual relationships with your co-workers, you will discover that your influence within the organization grows, and you will also find that people tend to be more empathetic towards you if (and when) you inevitably screw something up. If someone regards you as a "friend", they are much more likely to extend you some grace when your bugs cause them inconvenience. You will also find that they are more eager to pause what they are working on and stop and help you with things when you need it, or to answer your questions. In a situation where you aren't their friend and they don't stop and help you, you could easily be looking at days/weeks worth of delays and back and forth while they are being unhelpful. Sure, you might be a 10x developer within your little silo, but the moment you need something outside of the silo, you will find those interpersonal relationships can often make a huge difference.

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rinchik 7y ago
Please stop throwing around meaningless generalizations and banalities about "silos" and "comfort zones". > Your coworkers with stop helping you because you "didn't go to lunch with them, :sad_face:"! haha that's so silly, so naive, so sentimental! We are not children. And your office is not a playground. We are professional adults in a professional setting. > If someone regards you as a "friend", they are much more likely to extend you some grace Your co-workers are not your friends. Learn the difference, you are not Michael Scott (I hope).
- deleted 7y ago
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- t0mbstone 7y ago
  I prefer to work with professionals who also happen to be my friends (or at least friendly acquaintances who know each other's names). "Professionalism" doesn't have to be an impersonal facade that people hide behind. Work is all about meeting commitments and earning money, sure, but at the end of the day, we are all people, and people have feelings and frustrations. They have things they love and hate. They like being acknowledged and appreciated. This doesn't mean they are children and that the office is a playground free-for-all, though. It just means that your offices are going to be full of people. People who, for better or worse, are often just trying to make ends meet, and are going through the motions at a job they barely stand. I think you would be surprised at what a difference a little empathy, kindness, and friendliness in the workplace can do for a company's success, and also for your own career success (if you try it out). As a side note, one of the things that really opened my eyes to a lot of this was from reading Dale Carnegie's famous book, "How to Win Friends and Influence People". I highly recommend reading it, if you ever get the chance. I might have an extra copy that I would be willing to lend you, if you are curious?

ubercow13 7y ago

In my experience most developers, while often a bit introverted or nerdy, are not particularly different from normal people, who often enjoy social interaction and making friends. I can’t agree with your assertion that real developers are as antisocial as you seem to be.