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In the UK personal taxes are generally automatically handled by the employer. You just get the post-tax income transferred into your bank every month, and a pay

In the UK personal taxes are generally automatically handled by the employer. You just get the post-tax income transferred into your bank every month, and a payslip showing the deductions that were made. (Outsourced PAYE administration costs about £20 per month for a very small company.) It gets more complicated when you can't do taxes through PAYE for any reason - unearned income, dividends, directorships etc. My own taxes as a director of two firms subject partially to mandatory PAYE on some of my income are a US-level nightmare and once you are out of the 'simple system' getting back into it takes years.

johnwatson11218 16y ago
I read a book by Jim Rogers, I think it was "Investment Biker" and he said that the US is the laughing stock of the developed world because of the way our incomes taxes work. He said that in Australia you have one form the size of a postcard that everybody mails in once a year.
- brc 16y ago
  While I agree with you, it's not entirely true that you have one form that you post in once a year. While your 'group certificate' is postcard size, I think it's somewhat like a W2 (been a while since I received either), you still have to submit a personal tax return. For most people, it's just a case of reporting the information on the Group Certificate(s) (depending on how many jobs you had) and perhaps claiming on some deductions like uniforms or (new) secondary school expenses for dependent children. That said, the government is talking about moving to a model whereby you don't have to submit a return unless you specifically want to claim some deductions. This is more like the UK model. As for the US being the laughing stock - I don't know if I would choose those words, but I do think the IRS needs its wings clipped by foreign governments. The whole W8BEN form thing is ridiculous (so tempted to put F.YOU IRS as my contact details) as is the mind-boggling fact that the only way to not file a return in the USA is to renounce your citizenship (and good luck visiting your relatives after that!). The myriad of local, state and federal taxes, forms, rulings and corporate structures - well, I do wonder how much GDP is lost in paper shuffling. It can't be insignificant. Personally, I would have the tax laws in most countries scrapped and replaced with flat-banded taxes with zero exemptions. The tax rates would be lower to make up for the lost deductions, but in general, if you earnt X, you'd be up for taxes of Y. Corporations would be kept for their original purpose of limited liability rather than taxation structures. As noted above, it's all the special interests that get in, and, well, anyone who was tried to selectively reward children will know the impossobility of 'fair' once selective rewards and exemptions are introduced.

johnwatson11218 16y ago

I read a book by Jim Rogers, I think it was "Investment Biker" and he said that the US is the laughing stock of the developed world because of the way our incomes taxes work. He said that in Australia you have one form the size of a postcard that everybody mails in once a year.

brc 16y ago
While I agree with you, it's not entirely true that you have one form that you post in once a year. While your 'group certificate' is postcard size, I think it's somewhat like a W2 (been a while since I received either), you still have to submit a personal tax return. For most people, it's just a case of reporting the information on the Group Certificate(s) (depending on how many jobs you had) and perhaps claiming on some deductions like uniforms or (new) secondary school expenses for dependent children. That said, the government is talking about moving to a model whereby you don't have to submit a return unless you specifically want to claim some deductions. This is more like the UK model. As for the US being the laughing stock - I don't know if I would choose those words, but I do think the IRS needs its wings clipped by foreign governments. The whole W8BEN form thing is ridiculous (so tempted to put F.YOU IRS as my contact details) as is the mind-boggling fact that the only way to not file a return in the USA is to renounce your citizenship (and good luck visiting your relatives after that!). The myriad of local, state and federal taxes, forms, rulings and corporate structures - well, I do wonder how much GDP is lost in paper shuffling. It can't be insignificant. Personally, I would have the tax laws in most countries scrapped and replaced with flat-banded taxes with zero exemptions. The tax rates would be lower to make up for the lost deductions, but in general, if you earnt X, you'd be up for taxes of Y. Corporations would be kept for their original purpose of limited liability rather than taxation structures. As noted above, it's all the special interests that get in, and, well, anyone who was tried to selectively reward children will know the impossobility of 'fair' once selective rewards and exemptions are introduced.