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>why they find this comment so inappropriate It is just wrong. >Engineering is a social/ethical process, not a technical one This is just bizarre. >Yes, eng

by D_Alex 7y ago

>why they find this comment so inappropriate It is just wrong. >Engineering is a social/ethical process, not a technical one This is just bizarre. >Yes, engineers tend to have technical skills ...tend to have??? >What separates engineers from "skilled people" is professional ethics I'd argue that it is specialized education > when you use those skills to design a bridge >An engineer... who does not consider the ethics of their work cannot credibly claim to be an engineer at all. A bridge is usually designed by a team of engineers, who will get a specification (usually from another team of engineers and other professionals). One engineer may be a geotechnical expert, another might design piling, a third will specify the cement and aggregates in the concrete etc etc. Each contribution must meet the applicable technical standards and specifications. Apart from making sure your work is correct, how do you bring ethics into calculating the amount of rebar in your concrete slab??

na85 7y ago
>...tend to have??? I don't know about you, but there are lots of people I know who call themselves engineers but aren't actually very skilled at all. >Apart from making sure your work is correct, how do you bring ethics into calculating the amount of rebar in your concrete slab?? I think it's pretty obvious that I was using "design a bridge" as a proxy for any engineering work. But to answer your question: by making sure you do your due diligence with your work, and push back against superiors who want you to cut corners in your analysis for money, of course. The same way it works in any discipline of engineering. The engineers at Boeing appear to have been unsuccessful in changing the cost-cutting culture of their company, and the executives who ordered the cost cutting are ethically deficient. To put the ethics aside is to absolve the executives of responsibility. If you want a technical writeup of the MCAS debacle, the issue has been discussed ad nauseam in the crash reports. But those reports will lead to no material change if the CEO and other execs aren't willing to change their expectations.
salawat 7y ago
>I'd argue that it is specialized education Part of which in many programs includes familiarization with ethics coincidentally. >A bridge is usually designed by a team of engineers... how do you bring ethics into calculating the amount of rebar in your concrete slab?? You are not a calculator. You are responsible for ensuring your specific part is correct, yes; but being conferred with the power to halt something that isn't up to snuff or to reject a plan for unsoundness also implies a responsibility to exercise that discretion. You (as the engineer) have those technical chops that others do not. If you bow out and rubber stamp without a thought to the consequences of your actions, you aren't fulfilling your duty to the Public. With a bridge it's more straightforward, so it doesn't necessarily avail the civil engineer of the opportunity to exercise that discretion, but it is nevertheless there.

by D_Alex 7y ago

na85 7y ago

>...tend to have??? I don't know about you, but there are lots of people I know who call themselves engineers but aren't actually very skilled at all. >Apart from making sure your work is correct, how do you bring ethics into calculating the amount of rebar in your concrete slab?? I think it's pretty obvious that I was using "design a bridge" as a proxy for any engineering work. But to answer your question: by making sure you do your due diligence with your work, and push back against superiors who want you to cut corners in your analysis for money, of course. The same way it works in any discipline of engineering. The engineers at Boeing appear to have been unsuccessful in changing the cost-cutting culture of their company, and the executives who ordered the cost cutting are ethically deficient. To put the ethics aside is to absolve the executives of responsibility. If you want a technical writeup of the MCAS debacle, the issue has been discussed ad nauseam in the crash reports. But those reports will lead to no material change if the CEO and other execs aren't willing to change their expectations.

salawat 7y ago

>I'd argue that it is specialized education Part of which in many programs includes familiarization with ethics coincidentally. >A bridge is usually designed by a team of engineers... how do you bring ethics into calculating the amount of rebar in your concrete slab?? You are not a calculator. You are responsible for ensuring your specific part is correct, yes; but being conferred with the power to halt something that isn't up to snuff or to reject a plan for unsoundness also implies a responsibility to exercise that discretion. You (as the engineer) have those technical chops that others do not. If you bow out and rubber stamp without a thought to the consequences of your actions, you aren't fulfilling your duty to the Public. With a bridge it's more straightforward, so it doesn't necessarily avail the civil engineer of the opportunity to exercise that discretion, but it is nevertheless there.