4 ms·

Jealous of what? He earned 2 associate degrees and then spent a year and a half doing coding courses, and then got a part time job in IT after he got out, and t

Jealous of what? He earned 2 associate degrees and then spent a year and a half doing coding courses, and then got a part time job in IT after he got out, and then moved up to a full role. The entire story is basically no different to any other person who works there way into IT other than he’s an ex-Con and in the US it’s hard for them to usually get jobs.

mettamage 7y ago
I earned 2 bachelors (CS and non-CS related), 2 masters (CS and CS-related). My master grades are a 4.0 GPA equivalent, or at least the top 10 percentile and whatever is associated with an A. In total, I've studied 6 years in IT-related studies at an academic level. I have about 1 to 2 years of work experience while I was studying. These study programs took 8 years of my life (and are supposed to take 9 years if you study it in a normal fashion). Despite that, I can't even get the attention of any company in the US and it has been a dream to work at Google (I started applying since 2015), but they never respond with a coding test. In most cases they don't respond at all, at other times it's a rejection. So yea, I'm jealous. I'm happy for this guy that he got such a great turn in his life. But I'm also jealous. Why can't I get such a turn in my life? I'm doing my best. And it's not enough. And that's a painful message to see and it's mostly because I can't work in the US. Silicon Valley privilege is a thing. I want to be there, I have the skills to be there but I can't, because I'm not an American and I basically need to be a lot better in order to be flown over with a H-1B visa. I know what I do have (living in a western European country with a relatively good social system), and I'm grateful for that. And I'm sad that there are amazing programmers who don't get the chances that do serve themselves on a silver platter for me. Some amazing programmers get shit pay by virtue of the country they're in, and they can't easily be recognized and get out. And I wish they'd be capable of making a $100K as well. Nevertheless, I am still jealous (and grateful and happy for that person, I feel all of it more or less at the same time).
- unnouinceput 7y ago
  Oh, I know your type. I had once a boss that was like you, all academic background, zero practical skills. He was bragging around with his degrees and when put in front of actually programming something useful he'll just skimp around. Wanna know why you don't get even a coding test from companies? Because at the phone interview you raise all the red flags with your answers, so the hiring prospector realizes you're just a theoretical type, not a practical type. Piece of advice, do what my boss did, he went back to academic life and he's doing just fine there. You know the saying "those who can't, teach". So teach.
  - mettamage 7y ago
    You know why I 'brag' about my degrees? Psychologists never thought I'd be able to read or speak another language when I was young, that helped my resolve to show them that they were wrong. Moreover, my parents told me to stay in school because they never did and thought it was the ticket out of lower middle class. And I'm the first in my family to even reach university. No one, not even me (for a long time), expected that I could do it. While I'm not saying I'm the best coder (I'm not), I do have practical skills: - I created an OpenGL computer graphics engine. - I created a few games with GameMaker and Unity3D. - I helped built web apps despite being completely unfamiliar with the stack (two freelance contracts). - I created 2 iOS apps (two freelance contracts). - I made a semi-automated trader bot (not that it worked, but it was fun scraping the NASDAQ). I made a lot of other scrapers. The most fun one was to reserve for an exclusive restaurant that a friend of a family member of mine couldn't get reservations for despite that he was always clicking on it furiously just before the reservations opened. - I know my way around IDA Pro and have implemented a state of the art rowhammer attack called GLitch (with the help of the author).
    - unnouinceput 7y ago
      OpenGL computer graphics engine sounds interesting. Care to share it? I wanna take a look at it.
      - mettamage 7y ago
        Send me an email and then I'll send it to you that way. I need to uncover the source and get it up and running again, but it's something that I have meant to do in a long time. My email is in my profile. Also: while my reply was emotional, there are no hard feelings. Or like we say where I come from "we're equally good friends." :D
        unnouinceput 7y ago
        Put it on github, I'm sure I will not be the only one interested in it
- javagram 7y ago
  The other person responding to you is a bit harsh, but I’d point out instead that it’s quite hard for an American company to hire someone who is not a US citizen. I had a coworker myself who was a great programmer and member of the team, we all liked him but once his visa from studying here in the US after college ended, he had to return to his home country as my company didn’t have any way to keep him on legally. Just having a few degrees and minimal work experience probably isn’t going to be enough to break into the US market in many cases, you likely would need to be known as an outstanding expert or have some special skill to help justify issuing a Visa for you (e.g. the O-1 Visa). I’d suggest focusing on distinguishing your career within the context of the EU and if you still have the US as a long term goal look carefully at how best to get there. (Some others who have accomplished that probably have better advice, of course! As a natural born citizen I’ve never had to worry about this personally, but I assume I might face similar challenges if I wanted to move to the EU to work.)
  - mettamage 7y ago
    Well, I know that my first reaction ("I'm jealous") might invite criticism. I'm putting it out there relatively raw to see how people react and what they think. Because not knowing drives me even crazier. And it is how I feel (other than gratefulness, sad for the rest of the world and happy for the ex-con). I appreciate the tip of the O-1 visa and how to potentially get there. And I also appreciate that you state it very clearly that US companies did not choose for this fate either.
    - croh 7y ago
      Don't give attention to other people. But important thing is - money is not everything in life. You have still many things to make your life beautiful. You don't have to judge your success by money only. In fact, living on less money is more funny than being rich. Please search about 'stoicism'. I wish all good luck to you.
      - mettamage 7y ago
        I should read more about stoicism. Thanks for reminding me.
- mindentropy 7y ago
  I too have the same problem. In my case, I am in cheap outsourcing haven. We have IT company captives which outsource absolute crap work. There is no cutting edge to speak of. The last time I gave an interview almost 70-80% of the work was done in the US and they are throwing some unimportant work to their captive in their outsourcing destination. I have 13+ years of IT experience. Most of the good jobs are filled internally by some kind of favoritism and the crap jobs are floated to hiring websites. The level of technical work is a joke. Most of the companies try to hire my experience level people for junior positions(4 years exp) because the cost is low or tell to go to management. I see my friends in Silicon valley doing interesting jobs and yes, Silicon valley privilege is a thing. The American dream is a thing. By the way we do not even have a social system to speak of. So lucky you!
  - mettamage 7y ago
    > By the way we do not even have a social system to speak of. So lucky you! In what (perhaps small or big) way do you think others could help? I hope that we can eventually have a social system for anyone. I hope AI will take care of this with good political leadership (one can hope). However, even the Dutch social system isn't a heaven. It's good, but not heaven. Good: I have success stories from family members who got their hearing back after a 15000 euro's operation that they got for free-ish (and 25+ years of being almost deaf, so there was a waiting time but also the technology needed to be there). Other family members who got a stroke got access to government housing or free personalized medical care. Bad: I know one troubled person who is kind, but has a very very troubled mind. I'm honestly surprised this person isn't dead. The list includes almost freezing to death and being on your way to starve to death. And that's only what I know, and I know nothing. For the truly troubled mind, the Dutch social system doesn't work at all. Since all of my family is working/middle class, I wonder what goes on in the lower class families and the Dutch social system. My guess is: it's even worse. With that said, the "being significantly helped" to "almost death on the street ratio" in my family is about 3 to 1. And since I know almost nothing, I daresay that ratio is a conservative negative estimate in my particular family. Fortunately, most of my family is simply fine.
- dbuder 7y ago
  The google you want to work for is long gone.
rhacker 7y ago
The person he killed will never have the ability to get 2 associate degrees, a year and a half of coding courses or a part time IT job, let alone their first kiss, have sex, or any of that stuff. so yeah it's not just a "other than he's..."

mettamage 7y ago

I earned 2 bachelors (CS and non-CS related), 2 masters (CS and CS-related). My master grades are a 4.0 GPA equivalent, or at least the top 10 percentile and whatever is associated with an A. In total, I've studied 6 years in IT-related studies at an academic level. I have about 1 to 2 years of work experience while I was studying. These study programs took 8 years of my life (and are supposed to take 9 years if you study it in a normal fashion). Despite that, I can't even get the attention of any company in the US and it has been a dream to work at Google (I started applying since 2015), but they never respond with a coding test. In most cases they don't respond at all, at other times it's a rejection. So yea, I'm jealous. I'm happy for this guy that he got such a great turn in his life. But I'm also jealous. Why can't I get such a turn in my life? I'm doing my best. And it's not enough. And that's a painful message to see and it's mostly because I can't work in the US. Silicon Valley privilege is a thing. I want to be there, I have the skills to be there but I can't, because I'm not an American and I basically need to be a lot better in order to be flown over with a H-1B visa. I know what I do have (living in a western European country with a relatively good social system), and I'm grateful for that. And I'm sad that there are amazing programmers who don't get the chances that do serve themselves on a silver platter for me. Some amazing programmers get shit pay by virtue of the country they're in, and they can't easily be recognized and get out. And I wish they'd be capable of making a $100K as well. Nevertheless, I am still jealous (and grateful and happy for that person, I feel all of it more or less at the same time).

unnouinceput 7y ago
Oh, I know your type. I had once a boss that was like you, all academic background, zero practical skills. He was bragging around with his degrees and when put in front of actually programming something useful he'll just skimp around. Wanna know why you don't get even a coding test from companies? Because at the phone interview you raise all the red flags with your answers, so the hiring prospector realizes you're just a theoretical type, not a practical type. Piece of advice, do what my boss did, he went back to academic life and he's doing just fine there. You know the saying "those who can't, teach". So teach.
- mettamage 7y ago
  You know why I 'brag' about my degrees? Psychologists never thought I'd be able to read or speak another language when I was young, that helped my resolve to show them that they were wrong. Moreover, my parents told me to stay in school because they never did and thought it was the ticket out of lower middle class. And I'm the first in my family to even reach university. No one, not even me (for a long time), expected that I could do it. While I'm not saying I'm the best coder (I'm not), I do have practical skills: - I created an OpenGL computer graphics engine. - I created a few games with GameMaker and Unity3D. - I helped built web apps despite being completely unfamiliar with the stack (two freelance contracts). - I created 2 iOS apps (two freelance contracts). - I made a semi-automated trader bot (not that it worked, but it was fun scraping the NASDAQ). I made a lot of other scrapers. The most fun one was to reserve for an exclusive restaurant that a friend of a family member of mine couldn't get reservations for despite that he was always clicking on it furiously just before the reservations opened. - I know my way around IDA Pro and have implemented a state of the art rowhammer attack called GLitch (with the help of the author).
  - unnouinceput 7y ago
    OpenGL computer graphics engine sounds interesting. Care to share it? I wanna take a look at it.
    - mettamage 7y ago
      Send me an email and then I'll send it to you that way. I need to uncover the source and get it up and running again, but it's something that I have meant to do in a long time. My email is in my profile. Also: while my reply was emotional, there are no hard feelings. Or like we say where I come from "we're equally good friends." :D
      - unnouinceput 7y ago
        Put it on github, I'm sure I will not be the only one interested in it
javagram 7y ago
The other person responding to you is a bit harsh, but I’d point out instead that it’s quite hard for an American company to hire someone who is not a US citizen. I had a coworker myself who was a great programmer and member of the team, we all liked him but once his visa from studying here in the US after college ended, he had to return to his home country as my company didn’t have any way to keep him on legally. Just having a few degrees and minimal work experience probably isn’t going to be enough to break into the US market in many cases, you likely would need to be known as an outstanding expert or have some special skill to help justify issuing a Visa for you (e.g. the O-1 Visa). I’d suggest focusing on distinguishing your career within the context of the EU and if you still have the US as a long term goal look carefully at how best to get there. (Some others who have accomplished that probably have better advice, of course! As a natural born citizen I’ve never had to worry about this personally, but I assume I might face similar challenges if I wanted to move to the EU to work.)
- mettamage 7y ago
  Well, I know that my first reaction ("I'm jealous") might invite criticism. I'm putting it out there relatively raw to see how people react and what they think. Because not knowing drives me even crazier. And it is how I feel (other than gratefulness, sad for the rest of the world and happy for the ex-con). I appreciate the tip of the O-1 visa and how to potentially get there. And I also appreciate that you state it very clearly that US companies did not choose for this fate either.
  - croh 7y ago
    Don't give attention to other people. But important thing is - money is not everything in life. You have still many things to make your life beautiful. You don't have to judge your success by money only. In fact, living on less money is more funny than being rich. Please search about 'stoicism'. I wish all good luck to you.
    - mettamage 7y ago
      I should read more about stoicism. Thanks for reminding me.
mindentropy 7y ago
I too have the same problem. In my case, I am in cheap outsourcing haven. We have IT company captives which outsource absolute crap work. There is no cutting edge to speak of. The last time I gave an interview almost 70-80% of the work was done in the US and they are throwing some unimportant work to their captive in their outsourcing destination. I have 13+ years of IT experience. Most of the good jobs are filled internally by some kind of favoritism and the crap jobs are floated to hiring websites. The level of technical work is a joke. Most of the companies try to hire my experience level people for junior positions(4 years exp) because the cost is low or tell to go to management. I see my friends in Silicon valley doing interesting jobs and yes, Silicon valley privilege is a thing. The American dream is a thing. By the way we do not even have a social system to speak of. So lucky you!
- mettamage 7y ago
  > By the way we do not even have a social system to speak of. So lucky you! In what (perhaps small or big) way do you think others could help? I hope that we can eventually have a social system for anyone. I hope AI will take care of this with good political leadership (one can hope). However, even the Dutch social system isn't a heaven. It's good, but not heaven. Good: I have success stories from family members who got their hearing back after a 15000 euro's operation that they got for free-ish (and 25+ years of being almost deaf, so there was a waiting time but also the technology needed to be there). Other family members who got a stroke got access to government housing or free personalized medical care. Bad: I know one troubled person who is kind, but has a very very troubled mind. I'm honestly surprised this person isn't dead. The list includes almost freezing to death and being on your way to starve to death. And that's only what I know, and I know nothing. For the truly troubled mind, the Dutch social system doesn't work at all. Since all of my family is working/middle class, I wonder what goes on in the lower class families and the Dutch social system. My guess is: it's even worse. With that said, the "being significantly helped" to "almost death on the street ratio" in my family is about 3 to 1. And since I know almost nothing, I daresay that ratio is a conservative negative estimate in my particular family. Fortunately, most of my family is simply fine.
dbuder 7y ago
The google you want to work for is long gone.

rhacker 7y ago

The person he killed will never have the ability to get 2 associate degrees, a year and a half of coding courses or a part time IT job, let alone their first kiss, have sex, or any of that stuff. so yeah it's not just a "other than he's..."